Christ's resurrection, a myth or history?

HeXp£Øi±

Well-Known Member
Some critics charge that the Gospels have obscured the historical Jesus of Nazareth by cloaking Him in layers of legend and myth.[1] They claim that the Bible's stories of Christ's resurrection are myth, not history. There are at least FOUR REASONS why the mythological interpretation fails.

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Comparative literature demonstrates that myth takes a number of generations to develop. There are no parallels in other literature of myth developing and being believed in the presence of eye-witnesses and within the short timeframe in which the New Testament was formed.[2] (for more info)

Historical research is on the side of an immediate belief in Jesus' resurrection. An early apostle's creed includes the Resurrection (1 Corinthians 15:3-9) and has been dated by many scholars to within 3 to 7 years of Christ's death and resurrection.[3] This implies prior public belief. Scholars agree that the first letters by St. Paul appeared within 25 years or less of Jesus ministry, and the four Gospels within 21 (and no later than 65 years).[4] The preaching of the apostles always centered on the Resurrection. In a very short period of time, devout Jews throughout the Roman Empire who had formerly faithfully worshiped God on the seventh day of each week, converted to Christianity and began meeting on the first day, in celebration of Christ's resurrection.

Hundreds of witnesses saw Christ alive after his death. Once he appeared to 500 people at once (1 Corinthians 15:6).

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Many of these eyewitnesses to Christ's public ministry were hostile toward the Jesus the Gospels describe (Matthew 12:22f). These opponents had both motives and means to correct falsehoods about Him had the first disciples attempted them.[5] Yet their opportunity did not produce a serious correction.

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The Gospels don't resemble either Greek myth or Jewish legend.[6] In contrast to those, the Gospels understate and lack embellishment, yet contain details counterproductive to the invention of legendary heroes. For example, the following six factors in John chapter 20 are at odds with the tendency of legendary material:

* With great restraint, no attempt is made to describe the resurrection itself.

* Mary neither initially recognized the risen Jesus (the "hero") (John 20:14).

* nor even considered that there was anything special about Him (John 20:16).

* Indeed, even by the end of the day, the disciples (the secondary "heroes") were still in hiding "for fear of the Jews" (John 20:19).

* And, were the Gospels the free creation of paternalistic bias, as feminists charge, it is incredible the writers would have chosen women to be the first witnesses of the risen Jesus. The testimony of women didn't even count legally.[7]

* Yet, it was their courage the morning after the Resurrection that put the men's contrasting cowardice to shame.
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Jews were the poorest of candidates for inventing a mythical Christ. No other culture has so opposed mythically confusing deity with humanity, as did the Jewish.[8]


SIX SKEPTICAL OBJECTIONS most frequently leveled by critics of Christ's resurrection...

1. Christ's resurrection is a myth, not history.

2. The Resurrection stories are full of contradictions.

3. Miracles are not possible.

4. The body was stolen.

5. Jesus only fainted and then recovered from His wounds.

6. The witnesses were just "seeing things."



REFERENCES AND FOOTNOTES

# Rudolf Bultmann, Jesus Christ and Mythology (Scribner's, 1958). [up]

# John A.T. Robinson argues that, given its silence on the destruction of the temple in Jerusalem in 70 A.D., the New Testament must have been written prior to that date. For since the demise of the Temple in Jerusalem would have fueled Christian preaching that Jesus had replaced the Temple sacrificial system (John 1:29, Hebrews 10:11f), the New Testament would certainly have referred to its destruction as a past event, and distinguished it from the end of the world (Luke 21:25-28), had it already happened. [John A.T. Robinson, Redating the New Testament (SCM Press, 1976).]

John Macquarrie writes, "Myth is usually characterized by a remoteness in time and space... as having taken place long ago." By contrast the Gospels concern "an event that had a particularly definite location in Palestine... under Pontius Pilate, only a generation or so before the New Testament account of these happenings." [John Macquarrie, God-Talk: An Examination of the Language and Logic of Theology (Harper, 1967), pp. 177-180.]

A.N. Sherwin-White writes, "The agnostic type of form-criticism would be much more credible if the compilation of the Gospels were much later in time... than can be the case... Herodotus enables us to test the tempo of myth-making, [showing that] even two generations are too short a span to allow the mythical tendency to prevail over the hard historic core." [A.N. Sherwin-White, Roman Society and Roman Law in the New Testament (Oxford University Press, 1963), pp. 189-190.] [up]

# See Reginald Fuller, Foundations of New Testament Christology (Scribner's, 1965), p. 142. [up]

# See Frederick Fyvie Bruce, The New Testament Documents: Are They Reliable? (Downer's Grove, IL: InterVarsity Press, 1972), pp. 11f, 14f. [up]

# Eta Linnemann, writes, "The eyewitnesses [both hostile and sympathetic] did not disappear from the scene in a flash after two decades. [Many are] likely to have survived until the second half of the A.D. 70's... Who at the time would have dared to alter the 'first tradition' beyond recognition?" [Eta Linnemann, Is There a Synoptic Problem? (Grand Rapids, Michigan: Baker Book House, 1992), p. 64.] Interestingly, Dr. Linnemann was previously a negative critic of the New Testament in the line of Rudolf Bultmann. Having renounced her former position she now urges readers to "trash" her earlier works. [up]

# Michael Grant writes, "Modern critical methods fail to support the Christ-myth theory [Osiris, Mithras, etc.]. It has again and again been answered and annihilated by first-rank scholars." [Michael Grant, Jesus: An Historian's Review of the Gospels (Scribner's, 1977), p. 200.] [up]

# Michael Green, The Empty Cross of Jesus (Downer's Grove, Illinois: InterVarsity Press, 1984), p. 115. [up]

# M. Grant. writes, "Judaism was a milieu to which doctrines of deaths and rebirths of mythical gods seems so entirely foreign that the emergence of such a fabrication from its midst is very hard to credit." [Michael Grant, Jesus: An Historian's Review of the Gospels (Scribner's, 1977), p. 199.] Oxford's N.T. Wright demolishes Spong's assertion that the Gospels are Jewish midrash and therefore fantasy in N.T. Wright, Who Was Jesus? (Wm. B. Eerdmans Pub. Co, 1992). The two are different literary genres. And midrash is not fantasy anyway, but "tightly controlled and argued" material (p. 71f). See also Paul Barnett, Peter Jensen and David Peterson, Resurrection: Truth and Reality: Three Scholars Reply to Bishop Spong (Aquila, 1994). [up]

More on this subject.
http://www.christiananswers.net/q-eden/edn-t008.html#2
 
I'd have to say more myth than history, but some of both. I beleive there was a guy named Jesus that lived around then, just not all the other stuff surrounding him.
 
Lets consider, for a moment, the average intelligence of the time the writings were made. These writings were done by people to whome a piece of glass would be seem extraterrestrial...to them "matter" consisted of earth, rock, and wood. (allow me my exagerrations) I would think, if it were pure history, Christ may have thought to inform someone that the earth was round and much more vast than they knew. We wouldn't have had to wait 1500 years for that information. In short, if you were to ask a group of average 10 year olds to write their explainations for weather, geysers, mercury, etc..., They would be better equipped with knowledge than the average adult back then.
 
I'd love to hear Nalani's take on this, or was it Kuulani? Which one's the religous studies major i forget?

Squig- I'm curious why you think that if Christ(god incarnate) actually walked the earth that he would care anything for the sciences? If real he was obviously intelligent to the point of being shrewd enough to pull off this unprecedented hoax unless he was delusional in an extremely organized sort of way. He was after all intelligent enough to be informed of the sciences. In fact he had traveled to greece and commented on just how learned they were. So he was smart enough to be aware of these things yet taught that all things were secondary to faith.
 
I think natural curiosity would have lead him to know more from the Father about this world in which he lived. My main point was that overall, these were fairly ignorant people and therefore, more easily deceived...I don't suggest that there is no truth to the writings. Only that they must be considered for what they are. Personal accounts of occurances. That would leave the qualifications of the authors as their sole credibility. And those authors, imo, were not that bright.
 
Well i disagree with your argument but i understand where you're coming from. From my perspective it makes total sense that he spoke little of these things as the bible says that all of these shall pass away but that we humans are what he came for. As far as your opinion on the bible i have to strongly disagree. I think(my faith aside) as a piece of pure literature it's the most shrewd and intelligent book i've ever read and i read a lot.. I didn't come to believe this however until after atleast the fifth time i read it. Its shrewdness is not on the surface unless you are a literary scholar. Historically speaking you have to admit that some portions of the new testament are striking. There are other written documents such as the koran that conflict witrh portions of the bible but there are no written documents discounting his miracles. This from a man that had crowds following him around his entire life.
 
The historic theologians would disagree with your term "crowds". It is more accepted that he had his 10-12 followers and any crowd would just be the rubberneckers passing his pulpit. We can attribute as much to Charlie Manson. And no, that wasn't meant to compare him to Christ....:eek6:
 
I'm speaking of during his greatest miracles. Feeding of the crowds etc.

PS. i don't think any of charlies followers went on to write gospels much less anything beyond a guns'n'roses song.:D
 
HeXp£Øi± said:
I'd love to hear Nalani's take on this, or was it Kuulani? Which one's the religous studies major i forget?

*raising my hand* that's me ...


well, I have to be honest ... I didn't read the whole opening thread. But I will say this .. now, this is an educated opinion, not a personal opinion ... the dude was real ... he did exist, though many of his "miracles" may have been a bit pumped up for the sake of believers and story telling. Not that there's anything wrong with that - everyone needs something to believe in ...

The resurrection ... toughie ... personally, I think there's an explanation for everything that happens ... even if it's a miraculous explanation ... I do believe He was a special dude - I mean, he got thousands upon thousands to believe in Him and His teachings ... he got all those people to abandon their traditional belief system ... that's extraordinary .... and he stuck to his guns, more or less ... but, he's not the only one who's ever done that, even to that extent ... and I think those others are overlooked too often ... or looked down on ... Here's my personal opinion on the matter of christianity: .. Christ didn't phuck up Christianity .. Christians phucked it up .. no offense intended ... don't trip..

I think I should stop here until I actually read the opening part of the thread ... then I can actually make sense....
 
I'm not sure Christ COULD fuck up Christianity....

I'm not even sure he could be called a "Christian"...he's just...Christ...

That having been said,

myth..largely...and I think of Chirst as a real man with profound common sense when lucid, but also a really bad case of schizophrenia...

MADrin
 
I find these most interesting...

The Gospels don't resemble either Greek myth or Jewish legend.[6] In contrast to those, the Gospels understate and lack embellishment, yet contain details counterproductive to the invention of legendary heroes. For example, the following six factors in John chapter 20 are at odds with the tendency of legendary material:

* With great restraint, no attempt is made to describe the resurrection itself.

Jews were the poorest of candidates for inventing a mythical Christ. No other culture has so opposed mythically confusing deity with humanity, as did the Jewish.
 
Myth.
I'm not even sure he could be called a "Christian"...he's just...Christ...
If he existed, he was a Jew.
Jesus was a common name in that region back then.
Its a common hispanic name now. I'm sure it has derivations in other languages too, but I only understand english, spanish, and a little french.
 
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