The guy who claims to have written the health care bill admits he hasn't read it

jimpeel

jimpeel

Well-Known Member
It seems that Max Baucus has admitted that he has not read a bill he claims to have written.

SOURCE

Libby Residents Relate Gains, Drawbacks of Asbestos Aid

By Dan Testa, 8-24-10

LIBBY – Though the visit by Health Secretary Kathleen Sebelius to this Lincoln County community was brief, it is possible she gained some insights Monday afternoon into what residents here want and need – and how those forces are opposed in some ways.

Libby residents at the public meeting, held by Sen. Max Baucus, D-Mont., expressed a need for more help to deal with the asbestos-related diseases many community members are suffering from, yet they also wish to transcend the town’s reputation as site of the worst public health disaster in the U.S. to encourage jobs and growth.

They touted the increasing number of patients receiving care through the Center for Asbestos Related Disease in Libby, yet one patient told Baucus and Sebelius the clinic’s services were being stretched such that he no longer received the attention he used to.

And while some Libby residents thanked Sebelius and Baucus for the health care reform law that passed last year and extended Medicare coverage to those sickened by asbestos, others questioned whether the changes to America’s health care system were Constitutional.

The visit by Sebelius, following a town hall-style meeting earlier that day in Missoula, was part of an effort by Baucus to show the health secretary some of the needs of rural states, and to defend and explain the controversial health care reform effort Democrats recently passed.

“We’ve got a long way to go, but we’ve made great progress here,” Baucus told the crowd of about 40 gathered at Libby City Hall.

The new law contains a provision allowing sick Libby residents to be extended Medicare coverage as the only community in the country currently declared a public health emergency by the Environmental Protection Agency. That declaration stems from the thousands of Libby residents sickened, and the hundreds killed by tremolite asbestos released from the vermiculite mines operated by W.R. Grace and Co. Over the last decade, cleanup of the asbestos has cost hundreds of millions of dollars.

About 400 residents have signed up for the extended coverage, Sebelius said as she praised Baucus’ work on behalf of Libby.

“He does not let anybody lose sight of the fact that this is a town where there needs to be a measure of justice,” she said. “Our resources are really in touch with you folks on a regular basis.”

Gayla Benefield underscored the guarded optimism of some in Libby when she mentioned how, at a classic car rally that summer, someone was selling T-shirts, reading, “We put the ‘fun’ back in Superfund – come play in Libby.” Then she asked Baucus if the extended Medicare coverage could be repealed when a new presidential administration takes over, since she feared her grandchildren could suffer from asbestos sickness, making them the fourth generation in her family stricken with contamination.

A staff member for Baucus told her the health care law has the power of statute, and would need to be repealed for the coverage to go away.

Judy Matott asked Baucus if he would work to improve Libby’s image, and then asked him and Sebelius, “if either of you read the health care bill before it was passed and if not, that is the most despicable, irresponsible thing.”

Baucus replied that if Libby residents assembled an economic development plan, he would do what he could to help, and he took credit for “essentially” writing the health care bill that passed the Senate.

“I don’t think you want me to waste my time to read every page of the health care bill. You know why? It’s statutory language,” Baucus said. “We hire experts.”

In response to Matott’s question and another from a woman asking if the health care law was Constitutional, Baucus gave a broad defense of the changes, comparing them to programs like Social Security and Medicare that were unpopular when passed but have proven beneficial to Americans over the long term.

“It’s not perfect, nothing’s perfect, but I’m telling you, ma’am, it’s a good start,” Baucus said. “Mark my words, several years from now you’re going to look back and say, ‘eh, maybe it isn’t so bad.’”

“Don’t think so,” Matott replied.

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jim, since you've never been anywhere close to key decision makers at the top of large organizations, let me fill you in on something. they don't read everything. they can't. the volume of "stuff" is staggering. there are not enough hours in the day. or night. or both combined. they need to rely on a team of experts (AKA "toadies") to inform them about the impacts of minute details. this practice is universal among top executives. but perhaps not among cashiers, so it's understandable how this could seem like "a big deal" to you.
 
If I'm expected to be held to every word of a law; I expect those who are creating the law to have read every word of that law that I will be held to.

How can that possibly considered an unreasonable expectation for a legislator to do their job?

(also; read my sig, lololololol -- oops!)

20100105humormotivation.jpg
 
2minkey said:
jim, since you've never been anywhere close to key decision makers at the top of large organizations, let me fill you in on something. they don't read everything. they can't. the volume of "stuff" is staggering. there are not enough hours in the day. or night. or both combined. they need to rely on a team of experts (AKA "toadies") to inform them about the impacts of minute details. this practice is universal among top executives. but perhaps not among cashiers, so it's understandable how this could seem like "a big deal" to you.
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Just as soon as their title reads CEO, CFO, Toadie-smasher, or whatever, then they may follow your example.

However,

These people's job is to vote on laws. Not to play wanna-be Sct'y of State or President. Thewir job demands they read the exact wording of a bill, in order to determine that it is Constitutional & that they are comfortable that it does not violate their oath.

I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States...
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there's that pesky thing again
...against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; and that I will well and faithfully discharge the duties of the office on which I am about to enter: So help me God.
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They are not Kings or Dukes or Princesses. They are representatives of the people. Let their staff read the junk mail, not the bills.
 
what about "there is not enough time in the day and night to read through all that stuff" don't you understand?

do you expect that the CEO of ford designs every system in an automobile by himself?

you don't understand that there is necessarily task specialization and work breakdown structures in any complex organization?

*pssst* john boehner doesn't read everything either, but that's not a reason to criticize him, because he can't.
 
2minkey said:
what about "there is not enough time in the day and night to read through all that stuff" don't you understand?
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None of it. Their JOB is to read this stuff. What part of THEY ARE NOT CEO's, etc, do you not get?
 
they are equivalent to corporate executives in the sense of the size and scope of their jobs. it's their job to represent their constituencies. they can't do that if they spend an impossible amount of time reading boilerplate language. judges need legal clerks to write briefs and help them get through case law. doctors rely on nurses to perform many functions. maybe you should build your own truck to drive. and extract and process the diesel fuel. and build roads to drive it on. get it yet? no, still stuck on kneejerk i see...
 
The scope of their job is to understand exactly every word they legislate.

I, as a citizen, am held to every word of every law they create. I can lose my freedoms if I do not follow the letter of the laws they pass.



I'm guessing you'd be OK with the hot receptionist checking your prostate.
 
2minkey said:
they are equivalent to corporate executives in the sense of the size and scope of their jobs.
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THEY have created that beauracratic nightmare, not us. They are, simply, not executives. Talk to consituents, write law, read bills. I understand their underlings reading the crap from committee, but the final draft, the one that holds their name as a YEA or NAY is their responsibility. Allowing them to shirk this responsibility is what gives us the beauracratic nightmare.

It's also a good reason to not write 2000 page bills.
 
If one can't read a bill, one shouldn't sign a bill.
If one can't read Any bill, one shouldn't be in office.
 
the health care bill is the panacea

you have to pass the bill
to find out what is in the bill
 
oh, right, the incoming freshman congressman crafted THAT bureaucracy... just like the director of materials acquisition - who relies heavily on a supporting staff - at an aerospace company created THAT bureaucracy.

yes, we are each born into a fresh, new world with absolutely no history. fucking LMMFAO.

keep chasing those unicorns.
 
2minkey said:
jim, since you've never been anywhere close to key decision makers at the top of large organizations, let me fill you in on something. they don't read everything. they can't. the volume of "stuff" is staggering. there are not enough hours in the day. or night. or both combined. they need to rely on a team of experts (AKA "toadies") to inform them about the impacts of minute details. this practice is universal among top executives. but perhaps not among cashiers, so it's understandable how this could seem like "a big deal" to you.
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Do those same people claim to have written the documents that they have the toadies read? It seems to me that if I am writing something, such as this post, I shouldn't need someone else to read what I have written for me; and I should know the content as the author.
 
2minkey said:
what about "there is not enough time in the day and night to read through all that stuff" don't you understand?

do you expect that the CEO of ford designs every system in an automobile by himself?

you don't understand that there is necessarily task specialization and work breakdown structures in any complex organization?

*pssst* john boehner doesn't read everything either, but that's not a reason to criticize him, because he can't.
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But the CEO of Ford does not claim to be the designer of those systems. Baucus claims to have written the health care bill yet he doesn't know what is in it.
 
ResearchMonkey said:
The scope of their job is to understand exactly every word they legislate.

I, as a citizen, am held to every word of every law they create. I can lose my freedoms if I do not follow the letter of the laws they pass.



I'm guessing you'd be OK with the hot receptionist checking your prostate.
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The same people who will tell you that ignorance of the law is no excuse are the same people who are ignorant of the content of the laws they create.

That is acceptable in some people's worldview.
 
jimpeel said:
Do those same people claim to have written the documents that they have the toadies read? It seems to me that if I am writing something, such as this post, I shouldn't need someone else to read what I have written for me; and I should know the content as the author.
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You might be onto something here Jim, it may explain some of minxies post content. Maybe Minx dictates the principals of his post, and the value of post is lost in the translation as he has one of toady's post it for him.
 
It was probably a couple of interns working 80 hours a week who wrote it while he was playing golf.
 
jimpeel said:
Do those same people claim to have written the documents that they have the toadies read? It seems to me that if I am writing something, such as this post, I shouldn't need someone else to read what I have written for me; and I should know the content as the author.
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tell me about the longest, most involved thing you've ever written. because a paragraph or two really isn't all that burdensome.
 
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