Where are we headed and what are your concerns?

HeXp£Øi±

HeXp£Øi±

Well-Known Member
Ok we know everyone likes to bitch about Iraq but that is not the purpose of this thread. I'm curious what your thoughts and concerns are specifically for the middle east in the coming decade. What are your concerns and what leads you to these conclusions? There are bigger issues than Iraq imo. I was against it in the first place but it no longer matters now whether it was wrong or right since we're already there. imo an issue of epic preportions is being overlooked. That being Saudi Arabia. I wonder sometimes if people are aware of the state of mind of the Saudi population and the facts of the Saudi royal family. Don't people see what's coming? When the royal family is gone(and i don't believe it will last another 15 years) the US is in deep shit. There's a very good possibility that SA will be taken over by islamic fundamentalists. Also global islamic fundamentalism is learning as it goes and every day this idea becomes slightly more the universal vision that Osama Bin Laden has dreamed of and whomever controls the flow of blood has the power to kill. The rational is that we're dirtying the holy sites and the truth is that the oil of SA is the lifeblood of the USA. It sounds like something out of a novel but it's real and looking at the nationality of the 911 hijackers is only one of many signs.
If this one bites us in the ass North Korea will be childs play.
 
I don't know about you, but I'm headed to the toilet, and I'm real concerned that it won't flush properly. :tardbang:

As far as the topic is concerned, for anything to change over there, it has to happen internally. They have to WANT change. And for that, their situations have to change. Something's gotta give, but with all this hatred floatin' 'round, it's kinda hard to say how it's gonna get pulled off.
 
Iraq was a resounding success in every sense of the word.
History will show that we did the right thing.
Just like we did after WWII
like we did during the cold war
just more of the same we are doing the right thing like always.

I'm convinced that the next place America will be called upon to 'fix' is the dark continent. Can't have them tens of millions of people dying of HIV ya know.

Now if we could somehow just get the Chicoms to stop giving us the flu every year we'd get somewhere.
 
Oh in case you didn't know the war on terror was won in two weeks!

We have little left to do but keep a hundred thousand troops over there for the next twenty years.

Better than having them in Germany drinking beer don't you think?
 
HeXp£Øi± said:
There's a very good possibility that SA will be taken over by islamic fundamentalists. Also global islamic fundamentalism is learning as it goes and every day this idea becomes slightly more the universal vision that Osama Bin Laden has dreamed of and whomever controls the flow of blood has the power to kill.
Click to expand...


Its not only SA that has the potential for an Islamic fundamentalist rule.

If free and open Iraqi elections lead to the seating of a fundamentalist Islamic government, "I will be disappointed. But democracy is democracy," Bush said. "If that's what the people choose, that's what the people choose."
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http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,135868,00.html



I'm more concerned with Iran and its Nuclear program,since the US supplied bunker busters to Israel to take it out ,the US is going to be seen just as responsible as Israel if the bombs start falling on Iran.Iran has stated it will respond against the US which means the US then must respond taking out Iran. North Korea is sitting there going well there coming for us next whether we act first or not ,they are going to be more than a little paranoid and since they have new misslies capable of longer range I can't help but wonder if I'm all that safe on the Left Coast. Yep its a much safer world with "act first " mentality ,the Nuclear Deterant of the Cold War was only a deterant if both sides knew the other side would never strike first.Korea knows that the US will and thus is likely to use them itself with more than likely the backing of China,since they aren't going to like the US acting militarily so close to China.
 
America imports as much crude oil from Canada as from Saudi Arabia, if not more.

Our dependency on Saudi Arabia lies in their ability to control worldwide oil prices through manipulation of their massive surplus reserves.

If they refuse to cooperate, the price of crude could skyrocket.

It is a dangerous situation, indeed, but not just for the U.S.
 
"There's a very good possibility that SA will be taken over by islamic fundamentalists."

Hell will freeze over first.
Carter let that happen in Iran
It is more likely that after the election (Bushy's re-election that is) we will INVADE IRAN!!! lol

Damn I'm not the only 'tard 15 year old here huh?

Is there anyone in their right mind that believes for one second that we would let the SA oil fields fall into the nutcase's hands??? For cryin’ out loud!
 
Winky said:
Hell will freeze over first.
Carter let that happen in Iran
It is more likely that after the election (Bushy's re-election that is) we will INVADE IRAN!!! lol



Is there anyone in their right mind that believes for one second that we would let the SA oil fields fall into the nutcase's hands??? For cryin’ out loud!
Click to expand...

Did you miss the part where Bush is willing to let Iraq ?

If free and open Iraqi elections lead to the seating of a fundamentalist Islamic government, "I will be disappointed. But democracy is democracy," Bush said. "If that's what the people choose, that's what the people choose."
Click to expand...
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,135868,00.html
 
um like OK and stuff

It doesn't matter what kind of goverment the Iraqi's concoct

as long as we have 130,000 troops sitting there, Right?
even if we left at their behest
not a thing in the world could stop us from waltzing right back in.

As I said the Iraqi "conflict" lasted two weeks and we won.

Perhaps the whole Middle East issue has already been decided in our favor.

The conflict (which is over) in Iraq is merely a diversion, something to draw attention away from the real issues.
 
A.B.Normal said:
Its not only SA that has the potential for an Islamic fundamentalist rule.
Click to expand...

True, but from my perspective as an American it's far and away the most dangerous place for these extremists to take control more even than Pakistan or Iran.
 
we are headed to Victory

Do any of you see the Arab world getting their respective shit together militarily to the point where they could defeat U.S. on the field of battle?

How about a little history lesson?

The Vietnamese lost every battle. They had the backing of first China and then the Soviet Union. We elected to not march all the way to Hanoi and then on to the Chinese border.
We afforded them safety in the whole of the north.

This is not the situation in the Middle East at all.

What will happen as a result of the actions of our current administration is that the Arab world will be drug kicking and screaming into the 21st century.

The next 50 years will actually see an American style of freedom wash over the entire planet.

The pessimists will be wrong every time.
 
HeXp£Øi± said:
True, but from my perspective as an American it's far and away the most dangerous place for these extremists to take control ?of? more even than Pakistan or Iran.
Click to expand...

How about a geography lesson? lol
 
HeXp£Øi± said:
True, but from my perspective as an American it's far and away the most dangerous place for these extremists to take control more even than Pakistan or Iran.
Click to expand...
You don't think handing over the country, that your soldiers fought and died for in order to keep the ruler from supplying the Fundamentalists with arms and cash , to a fundamentalist regime is going to be seen by the American people as a defeat and seen by the Islamic world as a US defeat? WTF was the point of the whole holiday in the Desert then. Iraq is more centralised than SA and is alot closer to Israel ,losing Iraq is going to throw/keep the Mideast in turmoil far more than SA .IMO
 
Some experts suggest that if the government did implode, the extremists would rush in to fill the vacuum and the United States might have to move in to protect the oil supply in order to keep the world market in balance.

Almost all agree, however, that Iraq, which sits on the kingdom's border, could shift behavior and attitudes in Saudi Arabia. Last month, the two nations re-established diplomatic relations after a 14-year hiatus.

"If Iraq stabilizes, I see some hopeful signs," said Winbush, as the change would provide an attractive democratic model — and economic opportunities — for the Saudi people living in poverty and fear across the border.

"The other wild card of course, is if Iraq goes the other way and it descends into chaos," he said. "Then I think then you could see the Saudi regime being replaced by what I call 'The Nasties.'"
Click to expand...

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,128348,00.html
 
A.B.Normal said:
You don't think handing over the country, that your soldiers fought and died for in order to keep the ruler from supplying the Fundamentalists with arms and cash , to a fundamentalist regime is going to be seen by the American people as a defeat and seen by the Islamic world as a US defeat? WTF was the point of the whole holiday in the Desert then. Iraq is more centralised than SA and is alot closer to Israel ,losing Iraq is going to throw/keep the Mideast in turmoil far more than SA .IMO
Click to expand...

Saudi Arabia's current government has to bow to the pressures from Islamic Extremists even now. I'm with A.B., when Iraq elects an extremist government, it makes us look like impotent fools. I seriously believe the alternative (step on their throats till they capitulate) is worse, but I understand the people who don't.
 
A.B.Normal said:
You don't think handing over the country, that your soldiers fought and died for in order to keep the ruler from supplying the Fundamentalists with arms and cash , to a fundamentalist regime is going to be seen by the American people as a defeat and seen by the Islamic world as a US defeat? WTF was the point of the whole holiday in the Desert then. Iraq is more centralised than SA and is alot closer to Israel ,losing Iraq is going to throw/keep the Mideast in turmoil far more than SA .IMO
Click to expand...

I'm not sure i understand exactly what you just said there. If you somehow got the idea that i don't think a stable moderate government in Iraq is important than you misunderstood what i was saying. Anyway we won't lose Iraq. At the very least we'll set up a puppet regime and it'll be dealing with internal strife for the next couple of decades. The Islamic world already dispises the USA and failure in Iraq isn't going to cause them to hate us more. This might hurt our image but image is nothing compared to the financial woes that a radical Saudi Arabia could cause. These things are only on the surface. I can picture a radical SA even attempting to lure us into the "holy" areas and enfuriating the fundamentalist Arab world.
 
my concerns are whether more countries over there will hate us more. Also all the countries there have the potential to be theocracies. Namely Islamic fundamentalist. And if that happens I would worry about even more violence over there.
 
I tend to worry more about Saudi Arabia and the UAE than I do North Korea. North Korea doesn't have the resources to maintain a lengthy battle. Not enough oil reserves to mount a heavy ground assault nor to run the jets that tehy DO have. They're clammoring for promisses of non-agression from the Americans and access to buying oil. They're nuclear...despotic, but hadly stupid enough to launch one prematurely. :shrug: I'm thinking that most nations on earth realize that if they launched a nuke first, they'd find themselves joining the 'pink mist club'...vaporized.

Saudi Arabia has oil, power and despite 'proof' that they've funded terrorists, the support of the USA...for now. If they became fundamentalist...I'd figure that the world would hold its respective breath and adopt a wait and see attitude towards them.

I worry about Israel saying 'enough is enough' and doing a full invasion of Palesine. That'd cause one hell of an uproar in the area and we'd have to back them up. That'd get messy.
 
MrBishop said:
I worry about Israel saying 'enough is enough' and doing a full invasion of Palesine. That'd cause one hell of an uproar in the area and we'd have to back them up. That'd get messy.
Click to expand...

I don't think we'd have to back them up immidiately locally. Israel is a military powerhouse and could easily defend their borders. However if Iran or Syria were to get involved with longer rage warfar(missiles etc) that's where i believe we would step in. Your concerns about SA are well founded imo. OBL is not an idiot. He wants a holy war between muslim, jews and christians and there are good reasons his focus is upon SA as opposed to Palastine. In his eyes SA will be the spark to ignite the flame. I don't believe he's all that concerned with gaining nuclear weapons either. This is not his idea of how the war would be won rather he sees using (A) biological/nuclear weapon as yet another spark to enflame our anger just as 911 did. He envisions winning this war by having 100,000,000 jihadist Guerrilla warriors fighting the powers that be just as the taliban fought the russians. He understands economics and how 21st century warfare drains economies. He knows that it costs the US millions to fight just a hundred expendable Guerrillas and that on a large multinational scale this simply cannot be sustained.
 
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