Disagree with Obama, get branded a racist

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Inkara1

Well-Known Member
Hank Johnson (D-Georgia): Joe Wilson's outburst's logical conclusion is men in white hoods and sheets riding through the countryside

Jimmy Carter: Joe Wilson's comments are "based on racism"

Maureen Dowd: "Some people just can’t believe a black man is president and will never accept it."

Bill Maher: Drudge "Obama negs rise" headline subliminally racist

Keith Olbermann: "They will believe any rationalization, no matter how transparent, that what they are feeling is not racism."

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spike

New Member
Wow, when we used to disagree with Bush we only got called terrorist sympathizers, America haters, and commies.

The congressman, we learned, belonged to the Sons of Confederate Veterans, led a 2000 campaign to keep the Confederate flag waving above South Carolina’s state Capitol and denounced as a “smear” the true claim of a black woman that she was the daughter of Strom Thurmond, the ’48 segregationist candidate for president.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/09/13/opinion/13dowd.html?_r=2
 

Inkara1

Well-Known Member
Wow, when we used to disagree with Bush we only got called terrorist sympathizers, America haters, and commies.
And that is relevant to my post how?


I haven't been able to find anything that he's still a member of Sons of the Confederate Veterans. So if we're allowed to make the leap that he belonged to the group at one time, without knowing if he still is, and thus burns crosses, then shouldn't we also be allowed to make the leap about Obama and ACORN, etc.? I mean, if you're going to play the "your guys did this so it makes what my guys are doing OK" card, then at least be consistent with it. As for the confederate flag, I don't suppose you've ever heard the term, "heritage, not hate." For the third claim about the "smear," when did he call it a smear and what did we know about it AT THAT TIME? Until we know those facts, that argument is invalid.
 

spike

New Member
And that is relevant to my post how?

Let me illustrate this for you.

Disagree with Obama, get branded a ______ .

Disagree with Bush, get branded a ______ .

See the similarity?

While there is some evidence that Wilson could have racist tendencies there was no reason to be called terrorist sympathizers or America haters.

That said we don't know for sure if Wilson is a racist. Someone should find out if he's still a member of the Sons.

The Thurmond thing sounds pretty damn racist though.

Rep. Wilson, a former page of Thurmond's, immediately told The State newspaper that he didn't believe Williams. He deemed the revelation "unseemly." And he added that even if she was telling the truth, she should have kept the inconvenient facts to herself:

"It's a smear on the image that [Thurmond] has as a person of high integrity who has been so loyal to the people of South Carolina," Wilson said.

Of course, Williams' story was entirely true -- and never really in doubt. Thurmond was 22 and Williams' mother, a black maid working in his family home, was 16 when Williams was born in 1925. Thurmond supported Williams financially for decades.

The State story continued with Wilson wondering aloud how anyone could dare "diminish" one of his personal heroes.

Wilson said it is unfair to debate rumors about Thurmond when he can no longer defend himself.

The same goes for discussion of an affair Thomas Jefferson is said to have had with a slave.

"Sometimes these things just go on," Wilson said. "These are heroes of mine. I really hope these would be heroes to future generations of Americans. (The stories) are ... a way to diminish their contributions to our country's existence."

Six days and several furious letters to the editor later, Wilson was forced to apologize. But, amazingly, he maintained that Williams should not have gone public.

http://tpmlivewire.talkingpointsmem...-rep-wilsons-emotions-got-the-best-of-him.php
 
The truth is both side have been whiny little bitches to some extent. The cons have been far whinier and bitchier and more petty. The cons have also supported more of their case on lies and larger exaggerations.
 

Inkara1

Well-Known Member
Let me illustrate this for you.

Disagree with Obama, get branded a ______ .

Disagree with Bush, get branded a ______ .

See the similarity?

So? I said absolutely nothing about what happened during the Bush administration. What happened then has nothing to do with my post, which is that "racist" is becoming a common rebuttal for any criticism of the current president. You trying to say that people disagreeing with Bush got branded anti-American is simply you trying to distract others from the issue at hand. Related reading.

While there is some evidence that Wilson could have racist tendencies there was no reason to be called terrorist sympathizers or America haters.
COULD HAVE racist tendencies. Is "could have" enough for a conviction?

That said we don't know for sure if Wilson is a racist. Someone should find out if he's still a member of the Sons.
Indeed, we don't know for sure. I have seen testimony from people who know him that he's not, though. Further, if he is still a member of the Sons, assuming he's racist based on that would be another logical fallacy.

So if all other facts of the case were equal except that the maid were white, can you say for sure that Wilson would not have said the same things? Fathering a child out of wedlock and hiding it for decades would be a black eye on anyone's record regardless of races involved. Further, he does have a point about "ZOMG HE GOT A BLACK GIRL PREGNANT AND MADE LITTLE MULATTO BABIES" clouding up all the good things Thurmond and Jefferson did. Maybe he didn't word that point in a way that would make it clear to you in particular, but that doesn't make the point invalid.
 
As I have said before the right is obsessed with finding and parroting anything that might color the left as the racists. The left may be too quick to assume things but the right is obsessed with smear campaigns, they have been for years. When you have no real platform to stand on, attack the other guy!
 
Considering who Bush was and who Obama is, I still say more petty.

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At least they were on to something with Bush being an idiot. These criticisms above have little or nothing to do with reality.

Oh but wait, you agree more with the anti Obama sentiment, and that makes it all OK right?
 
Actually I'd like you to explain to me why my pics are not more petty than yours?

Obama is not a communist, no matter how much you dislike him or his policies and you know it.

Obama is not the Antichrist, and doesn't even show any of the supposed signs!

Obama is not a terrorist, and has done nothing to warrant such an attack. Just more lies and hype from the right!

Death panels? Come on, are they serious?

Dubya! said:
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"This is my maiden voyage. My first speech since I was the president of the United States and I couldn't think of a better place to give it than Calgary, Canada." --George W. Bush, as reported by the Associated Press, Calgary, Canada, March 17, 2009

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"One of the very difficult parts of the decision I made on the financial crisis was to use hardworking people's money to help prevent there to be a crisis." --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., Jan. 12, 2009

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"In terms of the economy, look, I inherited a recession, I am ending on a recession." --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., Jan. 12, 2009

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"So I analyzed that and decided I didn't want to be the president during a depression greater than the Great Depression, or the beginning of a depression greater than the Great Depression." --George W. Bush, Washington D.C., Dec. 18, 2008

"People say, well, do you ever hear any other voices other than, like, a few people? Of course I do." --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., Dec. 18, 2008

"I've abandoned free market principles to save the free market system." --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., Dec. 16, 2008

"You know, I'm the President during this period of time, but I think when the history of this period is written, people will realize a lot of the decisions that were made on Wall Street took place over a decade or so, before I arrived in President, during I arrived in President." --George W. Bush, ABC News interview, Dec. 1, 2008

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"He was a great father before politics, a great father during politics and a great father after politics." --George W. Bush, on his father, George H.W. Bush, Washington, D.C., Nov. 12, 2008

"Yesterday, you made note of my -- the lack of my talent when it came to dancing. But nevertheless, I want you to know I danced with joy. And no question Liberia has gone through very difficult times." --George W. Bush, speaking with the president of Liberia, Washington, D.C., Oct. 22, 2008

"I want to share with you an interesting program -- for two reasons, one, it's interesting, and two, my wife thought of it -- or has actually been involved with it; she didn't think of it. But she thought of it for this speech." --George W. Bush, discussing a company that improves access to clean water in Africa, Washington D.C., Oct. 21, 2008

"This thaw -- took a while to thaw, it's going to take a while to unthaw." --George W. Bush, on liquidity in the markets, Alexandria, La., Oct. 20, 2008

"I didn't grow up in the ocean -- as a matter of fact -- near the ocean -- I grew up in the desert. Therefore, it was a pleasant contrast to see the ocean. And I particularly like it when I'm fishing." --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., Sept. 26, 2008

"Anyone engaging in illegal financial transactions will be caught and persecuted." --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., Sept. 19, 2008

"We're fixing to go down to Galveston and obviously are going to see a devastated part of this fantastic state." --George W. Bush, Houston, Sept. 16, 2008

"The people in Louisiana must know that all across our country there's a lot of prayer -- prayer for those whose lives have been turned upside down. And I'm one of them." --George W. Bush, Baton Rouge, La., Sept. 3, 2008

"First of all, I don't see America having problems." --George W. Bush, interview with Bob Costas at the 2008 Olympics, Beijing, China, Aug. 10, 2008

"I'm coming as the president of a friend, and I'm coming as a sportsman." --George W. Bush, on his trip to the Olympics in China, Washington, D.C., July 30, 2008

"There's no question about it. Wall Street got drunk -- that's one of the reasons I asked you to turn off the TV cameras -- it got drunk and now it's got a hangover. The question is how long will it sober up and not try to do all these fancy financial instruments." --George W. Bush, speaking at a private fundraiser, Houston, Texas, July 18, 2008 (Watch video clip)

"I think it was in the Rose Garden where I issued this brilliant statement: If I had a magic wand -- but the president doesn't have a magic wand. You just can't say, 'low gas.'" --George W. Bush, Washington D.C., July 15, 2008

"And they have no disregard for human life." --George W. Bush, on the brutality of Afghan fighters, Washington, D.C., July 15, 2008

"The economy is growing, productivity is high, trade is up, people are working. It's not as good as we'd like, but -- and to the extent that we find weakness, we'll move." --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., July 15, 2008

"Goodbye from the world's biggest polluter." --George W. Bush, in parting words to British Prime Minister Gordon Brown and French President Nicolas Sarkozy at his final G-8 Summit, punching the air and grinning widely as the two leaders looked on in shock, Rusutsu, Japan, July 10, 2008

"Amigo! Amigo!" --George W. Bush, calling out to Italian Prime Minister Silvio Berlusconi in Spanish at the G-8 Summit, Rusutsu, Japan, July 10, 2008

"Throughout our history, the words of the Declaration have inspired immigrants from around the world to set sail to our shores. These immigrants have helped transform 13 small colonies into a great and growing nation of more than 300 people." --George W. Bush, Charlottesville, Va., July 4, 2008

"Should the Iranian regime-do they have the sovereign right to have civilian nuclear power? So, like, if I were you, that's what I'd ask me. And the answer is, yes, they do." --George W. Bush, talking to reporters in Washington, D.C., July 2, 2008

"But oftentimes I'm asked: Why? Why do you care what happens outside of America?" --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., June 26,2008

"I remember meeting a mother of a child who was abducted by the North Koreans right here in the Oval Office." --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., June 26, 2008

"I want to tell you how proud I am to be the President of a nation that -- in which there's a lot of Philippine-Americans. They love America and they love their heritage. And I reminded the President that I am reminded of the great talent of the -- of our Philippine-Americans when I eat dinner at the White House." --George W. Bush, referring to White House chef Cristeta Comerford while meeting with Filipino President Gloria Macapagal Arroyo, Washington, D.C., June 24, 2008 (Watch video clip)

"And I, unfortunately, have been to too many disasters as president." --George W. Bush, discussing flooding in the Midwest, Washington, D.C., June 17, 2008

"There is some who say that perhaps freedom is not universal. Maybe it's only Western people that can self-govern. Maybe it's only, you know, white-guy Methodists who are capable of self-government. I reject that notion." --George W. Bush, London, June 16, 2008

"Your eminence, you're looking good." --George W. Bush to Pope Benedict XVI, using the title for Catholic cardinals, rather than addressing him as "your holiness," Rome, June 13, 2008

"The German asparagus are fabulous." --George W. Bush, Meseberg, Germany, June 11, 2008

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"One of the things important about history is to remember the true history." --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., June 6, 2008

"There's no question this is a major human disaster that requires a strong response from the Chinese government, which is what they're providing, but it also responds a compassionate response from nations to whom -- that have got the blessings, good blessings of life, and that's us." --George W. Bush, on relief efforts after a Chinese earthquake, Washington, D.C., June 6, 2008

"Let's make sure that there is certainty during uncertain times in our economy." -- George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., June 2, 2008

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"I don't want some mom whose son may have recently died to see the commander in chief playing golf. I feel I owe it to the families to be in solidarity as best as I can with them. And I think playing golf during a war just sends the wrong signal." --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., May 13, 2008

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"I'll be long gone before some smart person ever figures out what happened inside this Oval Office." --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., May 12, 2008

"How can you possibly have an international agreement that's effective unless countries like China and India are not full participants?" --George W. Bush, Camp David, April 19, 2008

"Oftentimes people ask me, 'Why is it that you're so focused on helping the hungry and diseased in strange parts of the world?'" --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., April 18, 2008

"We want people owning their home -- we want people owning a businesses." --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., April 18, 2008

"So long as I'm the president, my measure of success is victory -- and success." --George W. Bush, on Iraq, Washington, D.C., April 17, 2008

"Thank you, your Holiness. Awesome speech." --George W. Bush, to Pope Benedict, Washington, D.C., April 15, 2008 (Watch video clip)

"A lot of times in politics you have people look you in the eye and tell you what's not on their mind." --George W. Bush, Sochi, Russia, April 6, 2008

"Afghanistan is the most daring and ambition mission in the history of NATO." --George W. Bush, Bucharest, Romania, April 2, 2008

"Soldiers, sailors, Marines, airmen, and Coastmen -- Coast Guardmen, thanks for coming, thanks for wearing the uniform." --George W. Bush, at the Pentagon, March 19, 2008

"I thank the diplomatic corps, who is here as well." --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., March 12, 2008

"Removing Saddam Hussein was the right decision early in my presidency, it is the right decision now, and it will be the right decision ever." --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., March 12, 2008

"Let me start off by saying that in 2000 I said, 'Vote for me. I'm an agent of change.' In 2004, I said, 'I'm not interested in change --I want to continue as president.' Every candidate has got to say 'change.' That's what the American people expect." --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., March 5, 2008

"And so, General, I want to thank you for your service. And I appreciate the fact that you really snatched defeat out of the jaws of those who are trying to defeat us in Iraq." --George W. Bush, to Army Gen. Ray Odierno, Washington, D.C., March 3, 2008

"Wait a minute. What did you just say? You're predicting $4-a-gallon gas? ... That's interesting. I hadn't heard that." --George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., Feb. 28, 2008

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"I'm oftentimes asked, What difference does it make to America if people are dying of malaria in a place like Ghana? It means a lot. It means a lot morally, it means a lot from a -- it's in our national interest." --George W. Bush, Accra, Ghana, Feb. 20, 2008

"There is no doubt in my mind when history was written, the final page will say: Victory was achieved by the United States of America for the good of the world." --George W. Bush, addressing U.S. troops at Camp Arifjan in Kuwait, Jan. 12, 2008

"I can press when there needs to be pressed; I can hold hands when there needs to be -- hold hands." --George W. Bush, on how he can contribute to the Middle East peace process, Washington, D.C., Jan. 4, 2008
'
Wow did he really say all that? Oh yeah he did! More petty? Equally petty? Please explain?!?
 

spike

New Member
So? I said absolutely nothing about what happened during the Bush administration. What happened then has nothing to do with my post, which is that "racist" is becoming a common rebuttal for any criticism of the current president. You trying to say that people disagreeing with Bush got branded anti-American is simply you trying to distract others from the issue at hand.

No, it has everything to do with your post. The right tries to cast everyone that disagrees with Bush as terrorist sympathizers and hating America and some on the left try to cast one guy with serious racial questions as racist aand you don't see the similarity at all? That's ridiculous.

Gonz and Cerise were immediately posting videos of people groaning or booing at Bush's STOU speech to justify Wilson shouting out "You lie" which is obviously far more extreme. Just as "terrorist sympathizer" and "hate America" is far more extreme than calling racism on a guy with questionable racist issues.

I don't advocate either but doing something to someone, getting it back, and then complaining smacks of hypocrisy. There also undeniably a ton of racist sentiment towards Obama. I've been frequenting the Stormfront forums and it's sickening and a lot of those people mix in without you knowing. Who knew the first mixed race president was going to be devisive and have some possible racial issues?

It's very hard to tell what people are just being racist because they hide it. It's a slippery thing to pinpoint. It gets called when it's not and it doesn't get called when it is sometimes.

Some of this ends up with the old "who's going to be the better man" situation. I'm trying to be reasonable but so many on the right are still not being reasonable. They talk about death panels, killing grandma, eugenics, commies, anti-christ, religious persecution through healthcare, Obama is a scary muslim, birthers, etc.

And you're going to complain about a guy who violated protocol yelling at the president with a questionably racist background being labeled racist? Ok fine, I've had insulting labels thrown at me since I've been on these forums and the left has had a ton of labels thrown at them through the Bush years.

Obama has been trying to be the better man and working with the other side. It frustrates me some times."Step on their neck, be a total tool like Bush was! Ram this shit down their throats like bush did." But alas he's not like that,

So I'll attempt to be the better man. How about I don't accuse someone of racism unless it's proven and you encourage the right here to cut out the commie, birther, death panel, etc bullshit?


COULD HAVE racist tendencies. Is "could have" enough for a conviction?

I picked that "could" word carefully. I'm glad you appreciated it.

Look, you're obviously smart and you don't seem to fall into the drama that some on the right do. You want to be reasonable? Sounds good.

Let's be reasonable. You gotta help calm down some of this craziness though. I know you stepped up on the birther thread but there's a lot more.
 

Altron

Well-Known Member
Newsflash: Bush isn't president. He hasn't been president for 8 months now. We have a new president. Get over it. Saying "It's ok for us to do it, because you did it a few years ago" isn't relevant at all.

The topic here is Joe Wilson.

Frankly, I think it's a big steaming pile of bullshit to say that he doesn't like Obama simply because of skin color. If a white guy was doing all the things Obama is doing, would all the Republicans get on their knees and worship him? No fkin way... they'd hate him just as much as they hate Obama. Their hatred isn't based on race, it's based on political idealogy. They hate Obama for the bailout, for the Czars, for Government Motors, for socialized healthcare, for many reasons.

But, when it's on the news, it's a lot smarter to say "Well, that guy hates Obama because he's a racist, so his complaints have no validity" rather than "Well, the guy hates Obama because he has serious concerns about his policies, and doesn't think that Obama is steering our country in the right direction" which would require further examination to determine its validity.

By branding any dissenters as racists, they discredit people who speak out against Obama's radical reforms, leaving no room for an informed discussion on the positive and negative aspects of Obama's policies.

As for the "Sons of Confederate Veterans" being essentially the same as the KKK, that opinion is completely misguided and ignorant. It's an organization based on cultural heritage. The Confederacy wasn't about oppressing black people. There were a lot of causes of the Civil War, and slavery wasn't one of them.
 
Blah blah blah....Frankly, I think it's a big steaming pile of bullshit to say that he doesn't like Obama simply because of skin color....blah blah blah

So you got one thing right! That doesn't change the fact that I have never seen anything like the hatred, hate-mongering, fear-mongering out of the "right" towards any president in all my years. Grant you with Bush it was bad, but not even in the ballpark as what we see now. It doesn't matter if it is racism, and I am sure most of it isn't. It doesn't change that it is hate-mongering and fear-mongering the likes of which this nation has probably never seen! I see a lot of it coming from you personally! I mean you judged Obama's speech to the kids and either you never even read it, or did so with such blind hatred that you could not have understood it correctly!

At least a lot of the hatred for Dubya was more deserved considering the man!
 

MrBishop

Well-Known Member
Frankly, I think it's a big steaming pile of bullshit to say that he doesn't like Obama simply because of skin color. If a white guy was doing all the things Obama is doing, would all the Republicans get on their knees and worship him? No fkin way... they'd hate him just as much as they hate Obama. Their hatred isn't based on race, it's based on political idealogy. They hate Obama for the bailout, for the Czars, for Government Motors, for socialized healthcare, for many reasons.

But, when it's on the news, it's a lot smarter to say "Well, that guy hates Obama because he's a racist, so his complaints have no validity" rather than "Well, the guy hates Obama because he has serious concerns about his policies, and doesn't think that Obama is steering our country in the right direction" which would require further examination to determine its validity.

Unfortunately, many dissenters on Obama's policies aren't concentrating on the actual policies, but circumventing them to push the hot buttons.
Hence, Birthers and their ilk who are more concerned about Obama's Religion, birthplace, race and socialist leanings than the actual issues.

Where are the Republican Economists? Why aren't we seeing the numbers on the front pages?

It's boring and won't get people riled up...so many dissenters push the hot-buttons instead.
 

Altron

Well-Known Member
Unfortunately, many dissenters on Obama's policies aren't concentrating on the actual policies, but circumventing them to push the hot buttons.
Hence, Birthers and their ilk who are more concerned about Obama's Religion, birthplace, race and socialist leanings than the actual issues.

Yes. Those people are idiots. It's petty and stupid to think that a legitimately elected president is going to be removed from office just because some toolbag on the internet thinks his birth certificate is fake.

Joe Wilson's concern was that we would end up paying for illegal aliens' healthcare through our tax money, which is a pretty legitimate concern. There has been some dumbass republicans fearmongering *cough*Sarah Palin*cough*, but it is unfair to brand anyone opposed to Obama as a racist. Yes, it was rude and not that well thought out of an idea, but it's a member of congress questioning a proposed law. It's his job to do that. It doesn't mean that he's a racist.


I mean you judged Obama's speech to the kids and either you never even read it, or did so with such blind hatred that you could not have understood it correctly!
mark, me hating that speech wasn't hatemongering. Obama outlined, in extreme detail, his evil plans to rule the world. every night he flies around in the ghost of United Airlines Flight 93 with his henchman Dick Cheney, plotting to destroy the economy and sell all the white people to China to be used as slaves. Afterwards, he kidnaps babies and drinks their blood. How thick do I need to lay this shit on before you understand what I was talking about in that thread?! Seriously. Ask spike. He understood right away.
 
OK, got it....

But both you and Joe Wilson either don't know or don't care to talk about the fact that we already pay for illegals medical needs! It's just another in vogue hot button issue to rouse the masses without having to actually use facts....
 

spike

New Member
By branding any dissenters as racists, they discredit people

Oh you mean kinda like branding people as "terrorist sympathizers" or "America haters" in an attempt to discredit them.

"Hey, we can throw labels at you but don't you dare throw them at us even when the guys has a questionably racist background"

"But yeah, we'll throw around labels like anti-christ, muslim, kenyan, eugenics, death panels, terrorist, killing grandma....but you guys don't call a questionable racist guy racist!"

As for the "Sons of Confederate Veterans"

Yeah, as for them.
 
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