2minkey
bootlicker
yes. there are many, many threads that prove such things.
Another Gun Thread
- Thread starter paul_valaru
- Start date
yes. there are many, many threads that prove such things.
jimpeel
Well-Known Member
I took my eight-year-old grandson to the Rocky Mountain Gun Owners .50 Caliber Machinegun Shoot in Fort Morgan and he shot the following:
.45 cal Thompson sub machinegun
Suppressed .22 cal automatic pistol
.50 cal M2 machinegun
Mac-10 sub machinegun (similar to Uzi in form and balance)
.50 cal Barrett Light 50
In all instances the adult in supervision was in full contact with the firearm holding it against rise.
The event runs three days and there has never been a firearm injury or fatality.
It sounds like the firearm spun on center to the point it came to bear on the child's head producing the fatal wound. The adult in supervision should have been holding the weapon against rise. This was a failure on the part of the adult in supervision.
jimpeel
Well-Known Member
Not your choice. Not your kid.
However, if given the choice of your child learning to shoot safely and properly, or your child being taught to shoot by Shwartzenegger, Willis, and Stallone, which would you choose?
I once had a guy tell me that it was scary to have my grandchild knowing so much about firearms and how to shoot. I told him this:
"If we put your kid and my grandson in a room with a firearm, who do you think will pick it up and who do you think will come out of there screaming for an adult?"
He said "I guess you have a point."
Why not? I had a .410 and went dove/quail hunting. The desert was nearby also.
Professur
Well-Known Member
How about none of the above. I'd rather my kids learned from someone who didn't fire off 9000 rounds and hit nothing. like, maybe, a certified weapons instructor.
Jim, not only do I seriously doubt such a conversation ever took place, I don't believe that what you supposedly said would change anyone's view one iota.
Professur
Well-Known Member
chcr
Too cute for words
Perhaps so, but it wouldn't have come from me.
Which is why I said "personally," innit?
Cute story though.
That's a little different than firing an Uzi at a gun range in suburban Massachusetts, isn't it? Circumstances and children vary. I still think eight is too young under most circumstances. Pretty clearly was under these, wasn't it?
BTW, I got a single shot 16 ga. when I was 12.
Hey everyone, let's jerk our knees and whine some more, huh?!?!?!? Won't that be fun?
Professur
Well-Known Member
I know it wouldn`t have. That's why it got it's own little paragraph.
GrandCaravanSE
Active Member
First off (8 year old+any gun=no good for anyone.), now that kid might of been alright if it was just a pistol, but WTF an UZI come on man, are you F*#@ing Retarded
. the sad thing is that there is nobody is to blame, it was at there own risk. i really hope that this doesen't put stricter limits on weapons. it is ok, i think that dad teach there kids to shoot hunting rifles, you know for hunting Deer of turkeys, or what ever you hunt. but to take him to a show and shoot a fully automatic sub machine gun is outragious, wait until he is 9 years old or something. sorry i think that last comment was too soon.
. the sad thing is that there is nobody is to blame, it was at there own risk. i really hope that this doesen't put stricter limits on weapons. it is ok, i think that dad teach there kids to shoot hunting rifles, you know for hunting Deer of turkeys, or what ever you hunt. but to take him to a show and shoot a fully automatic sub machine gun is outragious, wait until he is 9 years old or something. sorry i think that last comment was too soon.
paul_valaru
100% Pure Canadian Beef
I am PERSONALLY against guns, but that discussion happened long ago. I realize people will have and use guns, nothing I can do about it except live where the gun laws are stricter (which I do) and not have a gun (which I don't).
But if people are going to have guns, I wish there was some sort of course they would have to pass (like a drivers license). My Major issue someone put an Uzi in the hands of an 8 year old. This is a small machine gun, and the child was obviously not properly supervised. A larger machine gun even would have ended up shooting the sky, not the kids head.
And not saying for sure, because they are illegal here, maybe I might have touched an Uzi once, and learnt to respect it because the fucker will turn you right around if you try an action hero move with it.
But if people are going to have guns, I wish there was some sort of course they would have to pass (like a drivers license). My Major issue someone put an Uzi in the hands of an 8 year old. This is a small machine gun, and the child was obviously not properly supervised. A larger machine gun even would have ended up shooting the sky, not the kids head.
And not saying for sure, because they are illegal here, maybe I might have touched an Uzi once, and learnt to respect it because the fucker will turn you right around if you try an action hero move with it.
Professur
Well-Known Member
If you read the link I provided from the BBC, it says that there was an accredited instructor on hand who OK`d the kid with that firearm, and that the kid was familiar with firing pistols and long arms. This was his first time pulling the trigger on a full auto weapon.
I don`t know how much more supervision could have been provided.
I don`t know how much more supervision could have been provided.
paul_valaru
100% Pure Canadian Beef
Professur
Well-Known Member
Where would you place a hand on the weapon that would help control the recoil but not obstruct the sights, ejection port, etc?
Loading it with minimal rounds kind of defeats the purpose of giving him a full auto weapon to learn, doesn't it?
and an Uzi isn't a mountable weapon.
Actually, the only mistake I can see that was made was that the selector switch should have been on three round burst for the initial firing .. but then, it doesn't say that this was the very first trigger pull. He might have fired it earlier in the session and moved to full auto.
From everything I've read, the kid wasn't firing it one handed. Probably he lost his grip with his off hand and that's what let it jump the way it did. Had he been holding it one handed, gangster style, it couldn't have come back in this manner. He was cradling the weapon, using two hands, with his arms bent, and lost his grip. Holding it in that manner would drive his trigger hand down and back, setting up the head shot. I really don't see any way an instructor could have intervened.
Loading it with minimal rounds kind of defeats the purpose of giving him a full auto weapon to learn, doesn't it?
and an Uzi isn't a mountable weapon.
Actually, the only mistake I can see that was made was that the selector switch should have been on three round burst for the initial firing .. but then, it doesn't say that this was the very first trigger pull. He might have fired it earlier in the session and moved to full auto.
From everything I've read, the kid wasn't firing it one handed. Probably he lost his grip with his off hand and that's what let it jump the way it did. Had he been holding it one handed, gangster style, it couldn't have come back in this manner. He was cradling the weapon, using two hands, with his arms bent, and lost his grip. Holding it in that manner would drive his trigger hand down and back, setting up the head shot. I really don't see any way an instructor could have intervened.
jimpeel
Well-Known Member
I asked "if given the choice of your child learning to shoot safely and properly" and you say "none of the above"; but then say that you choose to have your child learn to shoot safely and properly from a certified weapons instructor. So I guess the short answer you COULD have given was "to shoot safely and properly".
Doubt all you want. That conversation took place at a curios and antiques handgun table at the Boulder County Fairgrounds gun show in 1995 or 96 as my grandson was looking at various pocket pistols which were more his size at seven years old.
Also, I never said he "changed his view". What I said was "He said 'I guess you have a point.'"
What I told the guy is a stock answer I use on doubters and antis and have used many times; but tell me this:
I have an eight year old grandson whom I have taught firearms skills and proper handling and safety techniques. If we were to put him in a room with your kid where a firearm was present, which one would be the first to pick it up; and which one would come out of that room screaming for an adult ... HMMMM??
If you're not going to answer that question then just don't post anything at all.
Professur
Well-Known Member
Well, phrased that way, I`d have to ask ... would your grandson be pointing it at my kid? No, my kid wouldn`t be the first to pick it up. First of all, it`s not his. Second, he knows better than to handle a weapon without an adult supervising. That's the rules he's been taught. Also known as Weapons Safety. Is he going to freak out and cry because he`s in a room with a gun? Nope. Will he shy from picking it up and using it in the event he needs to? I can't answer that honestly anymore than you can. Noone knows how they're going to react in a situation until it happens.
As for coming outta that room screaming for an adult ... he'll definitely be looking for an adult to tell them that there's an unsecured weapon left lying about ... and particularly if an 8 year old has picked it up and started pointing it at others.
Your stock answer has holes big enough to drive a truck through. I suggest looking for a new one.
As for coming outta that room screaming for an adult ... he'll definitely be looking for an adult to tell them that there's an unsecured weapon left lying about ... and particularly if an 8 year old has picked it up and started pointing it at others.
Your stock answer has holes big enough to drive a truck through. I suggest looking for a new one.
GrandCaravanSE
Active Member
He does got you there have you seen an UZI the is really no were to put a hand to help.http://www.gunsforfilm.com/images/spring_uzi_jpg.jpg
catocom
Well-Known Member
2minkey
bootlicker
um, dude, that thing projecting down a little rearward of the barrel is called a "forward pistol grip" and helps make the thing quite controllable. but that ain't a standard uzi. it's a mini or possible a micro uzi. regular ones have plenty of forward surface to grab on to, albeit horizontal.
