Did you hear that thud?

The text of your arguements have been addressed repeatedly. By looking at laws in other countries you may be able to see examples of what works and what doesn't, it's possible you may learn something....which the courts seem to recognize.

Consider the implications of the US Supreme Court, using the same lack of judgement, going to the Soviet Union to use as witness to a hearing on private property. Since the Soviet Union did not allow private property, it would completely change the decision rendered.

It's silly arguements like this that are getting you bashed in this thread. They simply wouldn't look to the Soviet Union for information on a private property law. Wow, see how easy that is?

Our judges evidently would like to look at many sources to learn, if you want to stay ignorant do it by yourself.
 
I have to say Gonz, that I still don't see it...noone forced them to change anything, and it's not because another country said so, it's because they looked at it and thought it was right...
there have been lots and lots of laws changed everywhere over the years because of progress...how are these any different?

how exactly literally is this against your constitution? they saw bad laws they changed them...I frankly am amazed that these were within the constitution in the first place...and still don't see how the act of changing them or the changes would be in any way illegal, or even "wrong" for that matter.
 
flavio said:
They simply wouldn't look to the Soviet Union for information on a private property law. Wow, see how easy that is?

Why? What makes it different? If they are going to abandon their principles & use foreign laws & rulings why not use the (former) Soviet Union? What country can we count out? The ones with similar laws to ours? The ones that are markedly different? What is the criteria for going to outside sources?

Once you open this can of worms it will never end & the blame game goes from in-house to world-wide.
 
Leslie, our Constitution is a set of laws for the government to follow. They are bound by those rules & may not enhance nor detract from them at will. It takes an act of Congress to change the limitations set forth. It specifically states:
The judicial Power shall extend to all Cases, in Law and Equity, arising under this Constitution, the Laws of the United States, and Treaties made...

under THIS Constitution, and again when they swear their oath
"I, [NAME], do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will administer justice without respect to persons, and do equal right to the poor and to the rich, and that I will faithfully and impartially discharge and perform all the duties incumbent upon me as [TITLE] under the Constitution and laws of the United States. So help me God.''
.

There is no legal authority to go outside these boundries.
 
Where the hell in the constituion does it say anything about executing retarded people?

The idea Gonz is to be able to learn from other sources, if there is good information out there they can use it. I don't see the problem. They're not abandoning any principles they are looking at all the information available.
 
Gonz said:
Leslie, our Constitution is a set of laws for the government to follow. They are bound by those rules & may not enhance nor detract from them at will. It takes an act of Congress to change the limitations set forth. It specifically states:


under THIS Constitution, and again when they swear their oath
.

There is no legal authority to go outside these boundries.
I understand all that, yet fail to see how any of these contradicts any of what you've posted here.

they read other laws, liked them and thought they fit in with American ideals, so they wrote them up...wtf is the problem?!

HOW is any of this exactly against anything in there?
 
flavio said:
Where the hell in the constituion does it say anything about executing retarded people?

:rolleyes:

THIS IS NOT ABOUT THE RULINGS. IT IS ABOUT THE METHOD USED TO DETERMINE THOSE RULINGS
 
Gonz said:
:rolleyes:

THIS IS NOT ABOUT THE RULINGS. IT IS ABOUT THE METHOD USED TO DETERMINE THOSE RULINGS
SO HOW IS THE METHOD USED TO DETERMINE THOSE RULINGS ILLEGAL EXACTLY?
 
Alexander Hamilton said:
The complete independence of the courts of justice is peculiarly essential in a limited Constitution. By a limited Constitution, I understand one which contains certain specified exceptions to the legislative authority; such, for instance, as that it shall pass no bills of attainder, no ex-post-facto laws, and the like. Limitations of this kind can be preserved in practice no other way than through the medium of courts of justice, whose duty it must be to declare all acts contrary to the manifest tenor of the Constitution void. Without this, all the reservations of particular rights or privileges would amount to nothing.

Some perplexity respecting the rights of the courts to pronounce legislative acts void, because contrary to the Constitution, has arisen from an imagination that the doctrine would imply a superiority of the judiciary to the legislative power. It is urged that the authority which can declare the acts of another void, must necessarily be superior to the one whose acts may be declared void. As this doctrine is of great importance in all the American constitutions, a brief discussion of the ground on which it rests cannot be unacceptable.

There is no position which depends on clearer principles, than that every act of a delegated authority, contrary to the tenor of the commission under which it is exercised, is void. No legislative act, therefore, contrary to the Constitution, can be valid. To deny this, would be to affirm, that the deputy is greater than his principal; that the servant is above his master; that the representatives of the people are superior to the people themselves; that men acting by virtue of powers, may do not only what their powers do not authorize, but what they forbid.
 
that makes perfect sense, but what does NOT make perfect sense is how the writing of these laws is against the damnable paper in the first place.
 
This independence of the judges is equally requisite to guard the Constitution and the rights of individuals from the effects of those ill humors, which the arts of designing men, or the influence of particular conjunctures, sometimes disseminate among the people themselves, and which, though they speedily give place to better information, and more deliberate reflection, have a tendency, in the meantime, to occasion dangerous innovations in the government, and serious oppressions of the minor party in the community. Though I trust the friends of the proposed Constitution will never concur with its enemies, [3] in questioning that fundamental principle of republican government, which admits the right of the people to alter or abolish the established Constitution, whenever they find it inconsistent with their happiness, yet it is not to be inferred from this principle, that the representatives of the people, whenever a momentary inclination happens to lay hold of a majority of their constituents, incompatible with the provisions in the existing Constitution, would, on that account, be justifiable in a violation of those provisions; or that the courts would be under a greater obligation to connive at infractions in this shape, than when they had proceeded wholly from the cabals of the representative body. Until the people have, by some solemn and authoritative act, annulled or changed the established form, it is binding upon themselves collectively, as well as individually; and no presumption, or even knowledge, of their sentiments, can warrant their representatives in a departure from it, prior to such an act. But it is easy to see, that it would require an uncommon portion of fortitude in the judges to do their duty as faithful guardians of the Constitution, where legislative invasions of it had been instigated by the major voice of the community.
 
holy skirt the issue batman!

you've shown me that you understandably may not like it...but certainly not that it's against this paper you hold so dearly.
 
Leslie said:
that makes perfect sense, but what does NOT make perfect sense is how the writing of these laws is against the damnable paper in the first place.

They have no express authority to use sources outside our laws.


flavio said:
That has nothing to do with any of the questions I or others have asked. Your just ignoring questions as usual.

I answered your question. To answer it in a way you'll understand It does not say it's okay to execute the retarded. It does not expressly forbid that action either.
 
no express authority...but is there any express naysaying? or is this just a barelighbulb cabin in the woods kinda idea of illegal?
 
Gonz said:
They have no express authority to use sources outside our laws.

If there was nothing in the existing laws about executing retarded people, what source would you have them use?

I answered your question. To answer it in a way you'll understand It does not say it's okay to execute the retarded. It does not expressly forbid that action either.

So where does it expressly forbid learning from other countries experiences, have you found anything relevant yet?
 
Leslie said:
no express authority...but is there any express naysaying? or is this just a barelighbulb cabin in the woods kinda idea of illegal?

What you seem to fail to grasp is our Constitution is a limit on government. If it ain't allowed, it's forbidden. That seems like Kazinsky mentality because of the slow & unabated progress towards the left since Roosevelt, if not sooner.

If you really want to understand how far we've come, I beg you, go to the link already provided & read the Federalists Papers, written by the originator & signers of the Constitution.
 
Gonz said:
What you seem to fail to grasp is our Constitution is a limit on government. If it ain't allowed, it's forbidden.

Wrong....If it not specifically forbidden, its allowed. Not the other way around. Are you really pretending to believe that none of our laws are influenced by world view? Thats really hard to imagine. :retard:
 
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