Prop 19: Marijuana Legalization Gets its Number in California

Gotholic said:
Here is what is not commonly known anymore, jurors can find the defendant not guilty if the juror does not agree with the law.
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Say what? Either it is a law or it is not a law. Congress (state or federal) makes them. Courts uphold them.
 
By the way, I am for industrialized hemp and medical cannabis use. As for recreational use, I am on the fence.
 
Gotholic said:
By the way, I am for industrialized hemp and medical cannabis use. As for recreational use, I am on the fence.
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Many people are in the same boat you are in. Even if they don't believe recreational use equates to drinking alcohol they still recognize that there are benefits to hemp (which does not get you high, BTW) and medical marijuana use. It just proves that people are not swallowing the propaganda and spin of either side. They are researching for themselves and making up their own minds on the subject.
 
valkyrie said:
Then you believe that the state of Cali should be allowed to legalize marijuana and regulate it's use?
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Sure, as soon you reduce the federal government to a government with powers enumerated.

Of course that would include:
  • Killing Obama care, I don't want to pay for dopers medical bills.
  • Ending the federal welfare state.
  • Shutting down most federal agencies and passing those powers back to the states as it should be.
  • Letting employers decide if they want to hire dopers or not.
  • More
  • More
  • More
Sure, I don't care if you smoke-up, it the federal government laws that keep it from you.
 
ResearchMonkey said:
Sure, as soon you reduce the federal government to a government with powers enumerated.

Of course that would include:
  • Killing Obama care, I don't want to pay for dopers medical bills.
  • Ending the federal welfare state.
  • Shutting down most federal agencies and passing those powers back to the states as it should be.
  • Letting employers decide if they want to hire dopers or not.
  • More
  • More
  • More
Sure, I don't care if you smoke-up, it the federal government laws that keep it from you.
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Marijuana smokers aren't likely to have any more medical bills than the average person. Alcohol drinkers are likely to though.

The rest of your post is unrelated to marijuana legislation. Employers can already decide if they want to hire people who use marijuana. I assume you like give them the same choice about beer drinkers right?
 
Beyond the knowledge that dope gets you high, you don't know very much dope.

As for employers, oh yeah, its kind of big deal. As a doper yourself, you are unaware/careless about issues that concern productive people who employ others. It's short-sighted liberal thing, like they cry about everything.


....and remember this too; driving isn't a right, its a privilege.. Enjoy your public transit.
 
ResearchMonkey said:
Beyond the knowledge that dope gets you high, you don't know very much dope.
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I don't know very much dope? Do you personally know a lot of dope?

As a doper yourself, you are unaware/careless about issues that concern productive people who employ others. It's short-sighted liberal thing, like they cry about everything.
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Ok, so you made all that shit up. We'll just ignore that as your usual trolling when you have no point.

As for employers, oh yeah, its kind of big deal.
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Ok, you're at least attempting a vague point here. Why would it be a big deal any more so than employing someone who drinks beer?

....and remember this too; driving isn't a right, its a privilege.. Enjoy your public transit.
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I enjoy driving and public transit. Kinda weird of you to say, but thanks I suppose.
 
delta9 is processed considerably different than ETOH. Your physical body is more complex than a coffee filter, your mind, not so much.

For one ETOH will process much faster allowing for a sober employees in the morning. You, not so much, you should be tested at work if you have anything to do with Gov't contracts. (Those portable showers you make don't work so well)
 
ResearchMonkey said:
delta9 is processed considerably different than ETOH. Your physical body is more complex than a coffee filter, your mind, not so much.
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Actually the mind is pretty damn complex.

For one ETOH will process much faster allowing for a sober employees in the morning.
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Actually most of the effects of marijuana wear off after 2-3 hours. It takes longer than that to sober up from being drunk.

Also, there's not really any hangover to speak of from marijuana, unlike alcohol were having decent number of drinks can leave people very unproductive the whole next day.

So in light of the facts. Why would it be a big deal any more so than employing someone who drinks beer?

Didn't you used to do a lot of Meth? How did that affect your productivity?
 
spike said:
Actually the mind is pretty damn complex.
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Isn't amazing how you can solve the worlds ills when you're stoned and then can't remember what they were when your sober? --- then you fall into the feel good commie ideology, its like being high.



spike said:
Actually most of the effects of marijuana wear off after 2-3 hours. It takes longer than that to sober up from being drunk.
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Not really, but you, as a stoner, might believe that. -- Enjoy your underdeveloped testicles.



spike said:
Also, there's not really any hangover to speak of from marijuana, unlike alcohol were having decent number of drinks can leave people very unproductive the whole next day.
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Yeah, pot is where stupid people come from. Especially considering it greatly affects your short-term memory, a crucial part of learning. An area where you show little to no gains.



spike said:
So in light of the facts. Why would it be a big deal any more so than employing someone who drinks beer?
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Again, alcohol is removed from the body much faster. Just because you don't feel high doesn't mean you aren't intoxicated, the fact is you are. (you're just used to being stupid?)

Where does delta9 reside in the body? Whats is ~90% of the brain made of? (clue: it's the same answer for both questions)



spike said:
Didn't you used to do a lot of Meth? How did that affect your productivity?
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I always produced more than I used ;)
 
ResearchMonkey said:
Sure, as soon you reduce the federal government to a government with powers enumerated.

Of course that would include:
  • Killing Obama care, I don't want to pay for dopers medical bills.
  • Ending the federal welfare state.
  • Shutting down most federal agencies and passing those powers back to the states as it should be.
  • Letting employers decide if they want to hire dopers or not.
  • More
  • More
  • More
Sure, I don't care if you smoke-up, it the federal government laws that keep it from you.
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There's no such thing as "Obama care." Didn't you follow any of the decisions on the Health Care Bill?

As for "dopers medical bills" you already pay for anyone ("doper" or not) who does not have health insurance when you or your insurance company pay your medical bills. The medical bills of the uninsured and poor do not simply disappear or get paid for by the health care fairy. We all pay those bills by paying more to cover those unpaid bills.

States do not have to participate in the federal welfare programs.

Employers have the choice to have their potential employees and current employees submit to drug testing. My employer had me submit to drug testing before I was hired.
 
ResearchMonkey said:
Not really, but you, as a stoner, might believe that. -- Enjoy your underdeveloped testicles.
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Actually it's a fact. Most of the effects of Marijuana wear off in 2-3 hours. If you get pretty drunk it can last much longer than that. Also drinking has much more negative health effects.

Yeah, pot is where stupid people come from. Especially considering it greatly affects your short-term memory, a crucial part of learning.
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Again alcohol does far more damage to the mind and body.

An area where you show little to no gains.
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My short term memory is top notch.

Again, alcohol is removed from the body much faster. Just because you don't feel high doesn't mean you aren't intoxicated, the fact is you are.
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No, the intoxicated part wears off in 2-3 hours. Where with alcohol some people can be hungover and unproductive for a couple days.

So again, given the facts why should marijuana be any bigger deal than alcohol considering just about everything about alcohol is worse?

I always produced more than I used ;)
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How old were the kids?
 
Gonz said:
The right to travel. You do not have a right to the any means beyond your feet. You must first purchase a horse. You have no right to one. On up the line to automobiles. The state does have the right to regulate the procedures.
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Sure wish we had time limitations on toll roads. I was told that's how it's done in France. New roads can be built for the purpose of charging a toll for it's use but only until the road is paid for. Then the toll is removed and it becomes a free road.

They put up a toll road in Austin. Some Spanish company got the toll rights and they are supposed to split it with the city. People won't use it so they're not getting the revenue they thought they would. So they've gone to cutting the toll booth personnel so that many of them are unattended. If you don't have exact change to go through you get a bill in the mail with an additional $1 in "administrative" fees attached.

I got one for a 60 cent toll. I sent them a check for 60 cents with a note about the booth not being attended. The next month I was sent a bill for the $1 "administrative" fee plus an additional $1 as an "administrative" fee for the "administrative" fee. I wrote my congressman and by the 3rd bill it was fixed. My complaint was that if they're going to have a toll road they need to have a way to pay it in cash at the exits. Not trap people to get additional revenue over the agreed upon toll.

Yeah, I do shit like that for $3. It's the fucking principle of the thing.
 
Gonz said:
The right to travel. You do not have a right to the any means beyond your feet. You must first purchase a horse. You have no right to one. On up the line to automobiles. The state does have the right to regulate the procedures.
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A good comment I found...


The driver's license was originally put into place around the time of the appearance of the first heavy trucks, which were traveling upon roads that, at the time, could not withstand such heavy vehicles. The license was invented to prevent these COMMERCIAL drivers from messing up the roads for the public use. Notice that all laws referring to a "drivers' license" will also refer to a "motor vehicle". "Motor vehicle is define by U.S. Code, Title 18, Chapter 2, Article 31-6 as:

(6) Motor vehicle.— The term “motor vehicle” means every description of carriage or other contrivance propelled or drawn by mechanical power and used for commercial purposes on the highways in the transportation of passengers, passengers and property, or property or cargo.

This is just the beginning of legal definitions which are designed to fool the (C)(c)itizens. Similarly-defined words include traffic, license, driving, driver, operator, and many more. Some states have written their own definition which now applies to all automobiles, however, any definition which has been outlawed by the Supreme Court is, of course, illegal. If your state has illegally-defined any of these terms or others, the way to defend yourself would be that you have to write a motion.

The reason that it is illegal to grant a "license", or "privilege" (basically the same thing, with the addition of illegal taxes), to a human being in order to use their privately-owned automobile for it's intended purpose, is because
1) YOU bought and YOU paid for this automobile. Since it is legal to buy this automobile, it must also be legal for you to use it for it's intended purpose. If it is not legal to use for it's intended purpose, it must also be made illegal to buy it.
and
2) The Constitution for the united States of America, AS WELL AS the Constitution of the United States of America, both guarantee you the "right to liberty," which, when defined by other included documents (many more documents were included by the composers of the Constitution to clarify it's intent), includes the "right to travel". A random human being may read this document and think, "This means I have the right to walk from one place to another without being stopped." However, the Supreme Court disagrees with that opinion, and only the Supreme Court's ruling in matters like these are important, except in cases when the Supreme Court's ruling is unconstitutional, which is not true in this case. In fact I believe the Supreme Court is right to extend the meaning of this document, and this is best evidenced by the following case:

"The right of the Citizen to travel upon the public highways and to transport his property thereon... is a common right which he has under the right to enjoy life and liberty... It includes the right, in so doing, to use the ordinary and usual conveyances of the day, and under the existing modes of travel, includes the right to drive a horse drawn carriage or wagon thereon or to operate an automobile thereon."" Teche Lines vs. Danforth, Miss., 12 S.2d 784

This case illustrates that merely having the right to walk around, in modern society, will, basically, not get you anywhere.

A RIGHT is something that all human beings are required to have, which means that a license CANNOT be required, because, if a license is required, a license can be, for example, "revoked". No authority of any kind EVER has the right to tell you you cannot travel in your automobile (as long as you are not conducting business).

A coherent legal document to this effect can be found at http://www.usff.com/iepsc/dlbrief1.html . Further research will grant you several hundred more cases of similar Supreme Court rulings - these are not publicized, because the biggest money-maker for municipalities - or should I say the easiest way for them to rob you, since Federal U.S. Currency is unlimited and they are all branches of this government - is to write traffic tickets and or arrest people for things that are not illegal related to automobiles.
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And then there is this:

"The use of the highway for the purpose of travel and transportation is not a mere privilege, but a common fundamental right of which the public and individuals cannot rightfully be deprived." Chicago Motor Coach v. Chicago, 169 NE 221.

"The right of the citizen to travel upon the public highways and to transport his property thereon, either by carriage or by automobile, is not a mere privilege which a city may prohibit or permit at will, but a common law right which he has under the right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness." Thompson v. Smith, 154 SE 579.

"The right to travel is a part of the liberty of which the citizen cannot be deprived without due process of law under the Fifth Amendment." Kent v. Dulles, 357 US 116, 125.

"The right to travel is a well-established common right that does not owe its existence to the federal government. It is recognized by the courts as a natural right." Schactman v. Dulles 96 App DC 287, 225 F2d 938,
at 941.
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