This is, too...

HomeLAN said:
Goodness me.
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Another friendly neighborhood administrator! :D

I'm with Prof and Les on this one.....you gain personal liability as soon as you become open to the public, so why should rights/smoking be any different?
 
Leslie said:
cause you're wrong. in his own home for his own private use, yes. but when you open up your property for the use of the public, you lose the right to do whatever the hell you want and have to do what the gov't feels is for the benefit of the public. don't be open to the general public, and you can smoke yourself beyond death if you want. otherwise, shut the fuck up and do what you're told.
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If a business is open to the public, the public has a right to go there, or someplace else. Nobody is forcing them to use that business. If that was the case, then you, and the others, would have a point. You are wrong, and getting angry is not going to change that. ;)
 
Using that argument, the people who were incinerated by going to see Great White have nothing to bitch about...:shrug:
 
Mirlyn said:
Another friendly neighborhood administrator! :D

I'm with Prof and Les on this one.....you gain personal liability as soon as you become open to the public, so why should rights/smoking be any different?
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Because smoking is not an illegal activity. Make smoking illegal, and, once again, you have a point. Until then, you can always go someplace else. If the owner wants to voluntarily make his place non-smoking, that is also his right. Once again...it's not about smoking. It's about the rights of the business owner to allow, or disallow, legal activities in his, or her establishment.
 
Leslie said:
but when you open up your property for the use of the public, you lose the right to do whatever the hell you want and have to do what the gov't feels is for the benefit of the public. don't be open to the general public, and you can smoke yourself beyond death if you want. otherwise, shut the fuck up and do what you're told.
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and that Ladies & Gentlemen is what seperates Canadians from Americans. Too bad there are so many Canadians living in the USA.
 
Gato_Solo said:
Because smoking is not an illegal activity. Make smoking illegal, and, once again, you have a point. Until then, you can always go someplace else. If the owner wants to voluntarily make his place non-smoking, that is also his right. Once again...it's not about smoking. It's about the rights of the business owner to allow, or disallow, legal activities in his, or her establishment.
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there is no intrinsic right obviously. He's opened a business, he has to follow the laws for business, not the laws of the land, but the laws as pertaining to business. period polka dot. If he wants to do whatever he wants, then he needs to close the business first. :shrug:
 
Leslie said:
cause you're wrong. in his own home for his own private use, yes. but when you open up your property for the use of the public, you lose the right to do whatever the hell you want and have to do what the gov't feels is for the benefit of the public. don't be open to the general public, and you can smoke yourself beyond death if you want. otherwise, shut the fuck up and do what you're told.
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I second that. Oviously. :D
 
Smoker John Dopilka said he understands the aversion non-smokers have to cigarettes, but feels like smokers are being slowly stamped out.
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ROFL. I wonder if that guy knows how phunny he is.
 
Leslie said:
there is no intrinsic right obviously. He's opened a business, he has to follow the laws for business, not the laws of the land, but the laws as pertaining to business. period polka dot. If he wants to do whatever he wants, then he needs to close the business first. :shrug:
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There used to be a saying here...We reserve the right to refuse service to anybody not meeting our standards. Notice the word right. Business laws allow for the owner to open the type of business he/she wants, and serve the type of public he/she wants. Period/polka-dot/whatever you want to call it the business owner has the right to allow/disallow any legal activity he/she desires in his/her place of business.

Funny that you are so against this whole 'business-owners choice' issue, when you are so against the 'ban illegal drugs' issue. :rolleyes:

As for the non-smoking beach, what a load of crap. If they're going to make cigarettes illegal, then they should just go ahead and make them illegal. That'll solve the entire problem, right everyone? :lol2:
 
As for the non-smoking beach, what a load of crap. If they're going to make cigarettes illegal, then they should just go ahead and make them illegal. That'll solve the entire problem, right everyone? :lol2:
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After all, it worked so well for liquor, and it works so well for marijuana, cocaine, etc. now.
 
chcr said:
After all, it worked so well for liquor, and it works so well for marijuana, cocaine, etc. now.
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Doesn't really matter, anyway. I keep saying it's not about smoking, and they keep throwing smoking back into the fray. :shrug: You can lead a child to knowledge, but you can't make him/her think...
 
You can teach them to think, however. Unfortunately, that no longer seems to be what schooling is about in America today. But that's a different thread (one that might include why you don't start a sentence with "but").
 
Quit your whining, Gato. At least it won't cost you your job.

Irish MP loses post for smoking in parliamentary bar, defying ban





DUBLIN, Ireland (AP) - Ireland's sweeping new ban on workplace smoking claimed its first casualty Thursday: a high-profile legislator who lost his political post after lighting up in the parliamentary bar.

John Deasy, who was supposed to lead the Fine Gael party's official support for the ban, was punished after smoking at least three cigarettes Tuesday night in the bar beside the debating chamber. Fellow legislators said Deasy had tried to open a locked emergency door into an outdoor courtyard. When the bar staff wouldn't let him out, he began smoking indoors in violation of the ban.

Fine Gael leader Enda Kenny said he had no choice but to dismiss Deasy from his justice post in the shadow cabinet.

"Politicians must lead by example. No man, no woman, and no politician is above the law," Kenny said.

Kenny said Deasy may also face prosecution. The ban specifies a maximum fine equivalent to about $4,850 Cdn for anyone who smokes in an enclosed workplace.

Deasy, 35, declined to comment. He will remain a legislator representing Waterford in southeast Ireland.

The son of a former agriculture minister, Deasy had been tipped as a possible future Fine Gael leader. He frequently captured media attention with his stinging attacks on the government, left-wing opposition parties and even, to the anger of Kenny, his own right-leaning party.

Representatives of more than 10,000 pub owners in Ireland have claimed the ban will cost them business in a country where about 30 per cent of adults smoke. So far, however, pubs have reported few problems in enforcement. Unlike the parliamentary bar, some have created new outdoor areas where drinkers can still smoke legally.
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source
 
No, Gato. I didn't miss it. I'm ignoring your point, because there's another point to be dealt with, and you're ignoring it. You can bleat on about your right to smoke all you want. I drop you right in with those who want to drive 100mph.


Oh, a little annecdote. At lunch, I came outta a large retail store (Canadian Tire, sorta like Walmart) and there was a guy standing outside, smoking. I said, politely "Buddy, you aren't supposed to smoke here." Well, the guy lost it. "All fucking winter, I've had to smoke outside because of you bastard non-smokers and your damn rules. Fuck you, I'll smoke where I want to. Go fuck off" (all in french, btw). Well, I looked at him for a sec, and then said, in a weary voice. "Suit yourself. But when you were smoking out here all winter, did you happen to notice that you're leaning against a cage of full propane tanks?"

But you guys know what's best for you. Go ahead. Light up. Enjoy the cancer causing fumes you share with the unwilling.
 
Professur said:
No, Gato. I didn't miss it. I'm ignoring your point, because there's another point to be dealt with, and you're ignoring it. You can bleat on about your right to smoke all you want. I drop you right in with those who want to drive 100mph.


Oh, a little annecdote. At lunch, I came outta a large retail store (Canadian Tire, sorta like Walmart) and there was a guy standing outside, smoking. I said, politely "Buddy, you aren't supposed to smoke here." Well, the guy lost it. "All fucking winter, I've had to smoke outside because of you bastard non-smokers and your damn rules. Fuck you, I'll smoke where I want to. Go fuck off" (all in french, btw). Well, I looked at him for a sec, and then said, in a weary voice. "Suit yourself. But when you were smoking out here all winter, did you happen to notice that you're leaning against a cage of full propane tanks?"

But you guys know what's best for you. Go ahead. Light up. Enjoy the cancer causing fumes you share with the unwilling.
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Sorry, prof, but that's not what it's about. You wish to act ignorant, then do so, but don't do it with me. It's about the rights of the owner to allow, or disallow, any legal activity in his place of business he sees fit. You choose to ignore that point, and jump on smoking because it suits you and what you want to see. I do not see this as a smoking/non-smoking issue. I've stated numerous times that it wasn't about smoking, and you chose to ignore that. Shows who actually is paying attention, doesn't it?
 
Professur said:
No, Gato. I didn't miss it. I'm ignoring your point, because there's another point to be dealt with, and you're ignoring it. You can bleat on about your right to smoke all you want. I drop you right in with those who want to drive 100mph.

But you guys know what's best for you. Go ahead. Light up. Enjoy the cancer causing fumes you share with the unwilling.
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Which is why the Americans are arguing the point & the Canadians blindly accepted it. Private property rights have eroded to the point we all might as well rent. Why own your home or business when some do-gooder can come along & tell you what you can't do, that is legal, on your property.

Smoking is not a proven cause of cancer.
 
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