Today's the day...
- Thread starter HeXp£Øi±
- Start date
A.B.Normal
New Member
If Sadam feels compelled he might just fire the first shot ,after all he has nothing to lose at this point,in which case we're talking minutes rather than hours.I'm pretty sure ,like previous engagements ,it'll be all "AIR" for the first while(MOABS,Tomahawks,B2 ,A10 etc..) ,ground troups won't really play a part for several days,unless its to round up refugees and surrendering soldiers.
MrBishop
Well-Known Member
I doubt that the fighting will happen that quickly after the 8pm deadline...frankly, the the USA et al, will want some form of surprise on their side...
Why not just let the Iraq soldiers stew for a while in their fox-holes and lose sleep before starting the pounding. It'll give them a few days to surrender...or (in Bush's eyes) better yet...make a mistake and attack first. Voila! instant justification.
Why not just let the Iraq soldiers stew for a while in their fox-holes and lose sleep before starting the pounding. It'll give them a few days to surrender...or (in Bush's eyes) better yet...make a mistake and attack first. Voila! instant justification.
That would be cool. No shit, that would give them nervous breakdowns. And fly overhead just to let them know that the planes are in fact there.
Jeslek
Banned
"Let your plans be dark and as impenetratable as night, and when you move, fall like a thunderbolt."
- Sun Tzu, The Art of War
"If your opponent is of choleric temper, try to irritate him. If he is arrogant try to encourage his egotism. (If the enemy troops are well prepared after reorganization, try to wear them down. If they are united, try to sow dissension among them."
- General Tao Hanzhang, translated by Yuan Shibing, Sun Tzu's The Art Of War
"One need not destroy one's enemy. One need only destroy his willingness to engage."
- Sun Tzu
- Sun Tzu, The Art of War
"If your opponent is of choleric temper, try to irritate him. If he is arrogant try to encourage his egotism. (If the enemy troops are well prepared after reorganization, try to wear them down. If they are united, try to sow dissension among them."
- General Tao Hanzhang, translated by Yuan Shibing, Sun Tzu's The Art Of War
"One need not destroy one's enemy. One need only destroy his willingness to engage."
- Sun Tzu
unclehobart
New Member
British and American troops were involved in fierce fighting near Iraq's main port today as the war to topple Saddam Hussein began.
The firefight broke out near Basra as men of the Special Boat Service targeted the strategically vital city and the oilfields in southern Iraq.
At the same time allied troops were flooding into the demilitarised zone on the Iraqi border with Kuwait 40 miles away to take up positions for an all-out invasion.
Cruise missiles were also loaded onto B52 bombers at RAF Fairford in Gloucestershire, a clear sign that the bombardment of Baghdad could be only hours away.
British troops taking up "forward battle positions" were ordered to switch off satellite phones and allied warplanes bombed targets in Iraq after coming under fire in the no-fly zone.
By lunchtime, allied forces were in position to strike from the moment the 48-hour deadline set by President Bush for Saddam to quit Iraq expires at 1am British time tomorrow. But the White House had refused to rule out a strike before that.
The fighting reported at Basra was believed to involve British special forces and US marines in an operation to prepare landing sites for amphibious craft during an invasion.
Other special units were deep inside Iraq on secret operations to prepare landing strips in the desert for airborne troops.
Basra, Iraq's only seaport, lies on the Shatt al Arab waterway where the Tigris and the Euphrates open into the northern Gulf.
Surrounded by treacherous sandbanks and marshes it is difficult to approach from the sea.
Artillery, infantry and the tanks of the 7th Armoured Brigade had already moved into Forming Up Positions, and some were already on the start line.
An attack could target Basra and proceed up alongside the Euphrates towards the strategic cities of Nasariya, Najaf and Karbala.
Tony Blair said he believed all MPs, irrespective of their views on the war, now wished British troops well.
"I know everyone in this House wishes our Armed Forces well," he said in the Commons.
A sandstorm whipped across northern Kuwait as the pace of preparations suddenly quickened Kuwaiti security sources disclosed that allied troops move into the demilitarised zone, which straddles the Iraq-Kuwait border, at around 11am local time, 8am UK time.
The source, working in the Umm Qasr area in the east of the zone, said: "American convoys are still driving towards Umm Qasr."
A US military spokesman said he could not confirm or deny that troops were inside the zone.
A British Army spokesman said only that soldiers had taken up " forward battle positions".
At Fairford, 14 giant American B52 bombers which will lead the fight against Saddam were loaded up with cruise missiles this morning.
The first flight of B52s were expected to take off two hours before sunset to give them enough flying time to identify their targets and drop their first devastating payload before heading for home.
The missiles were driven to the aircraft in five articulated lorries escorted by police at 10.30am.
Troops meticulously loaded the weapons - each costing around £1million - into the bomb bays by forklift truck.
With an estimated flight time of only six hours to Iraq the bombers are expected to play a huge part in the initial air bombardment. A single B52 can deliver a payload of more than 70,000lb at a range of 8,800 miles without being refuelled. They are likely to take up positions over the Mediterranean or the Red Sea to unleash cruise missiles or satelliteguided smart bombs. RAF Tornados, Harriers and Jaguars are also likely to be involved in the opening 48-hour offensive.
The Tornados will be given the specific task of taking out air defences and barracks round small missile batteries and air strips in the Iraqi desert.
This will enable the enemy positions to be quickly seized by airborne forces and turned into bases for the advancing allied armies.
The Harrier force of up to 20 planes has the job of supporting special forces, the SAS and Special Boat Service and American Rangers in the hunt for Scud missile sites and any artillery shells with chemical warheads. Intelligence suggests Saddam has given his generals personal authority to unleash the deadly weapons as a last desperate measure to hold the Allies off from attacking Baghdad.
The mainstay of the bombing attack will be the 750 American and British fighter bombers from Gulf bases and the six American aircraft carriers now at battle stations in the Mediterranean and the Arabian Sea.
The aircraft, including RAF Tornados and Harriers, F16s, F15s and F18 Hornets will work on a "taxi rank" basis, forming ranks in the air before being sent in on targets. Along with the B52s from Fairford, other longrange bombers include the almost mythical B2 Spirit bat-wing supersonic aircraft which will fly from bases on Diego Garcia. Also spearheading the attack will be B1B Lancer and F117 Stealth bombers.
Action began in the air today as warplanes from the USS Abraham Lincoln bombed Iraqi positions after coalition aircraft - including two RAF Harrier jets - were fired on by Iraqi forces.
"There were, yesterday, four firings against our aircraft flying in the southern no-fly zone," Rear Admiral John Kelly told reporters on board the Lincoln. He said US forces had responded by bombing "a series of targets" he described as "command and control" positions.
The firefight broke out near Basra as men of the Special Boat Service targeted the strategically vital city and the oilfields in southern Iraq.
At the same time allied troops were flooding into the demilitarised zone on the Iraqi border with Kuwait 40 miles away to take up positions for an all-out invasion.
Cruise missiles were also loaded onto B52 bombers at RAF Fairford in Gloucestershire, a clear sign that the bombardment of Baghdad could be only hours away.
British troops taking up "forward battle positions" were ordered to switch off satellite phones and allied warplanes bombed targets in Iraq after coming under fire in the no-fly zone.
By lunchtime, allied forces were in position to strike from the moment the 48-hour deadline set by President Bush for Saddam to quit Iraq expires at 1am British time tomorrow. But the White House had refused to rule out a strike before that.
The fighting reported at Basra was believed to involve British special forces and US marines in an operation to prepare landing sites for amphibious craft during an invasion.
Other special units were deep inside Iraq on secret operations to prepare landing strips in the desert for airborne troops.
Basra, Iraq's only seaport, lies on the Shatt al Arab waterway where the Tigris and the Euphrates open into the northern Gulf.
Surrounded by treacherous sandbanks and marshes it is difficult to approach from the sea.
Artillery, infantry and the tanks of the 7th Armoured Brigade had already moved into Forming Up Positions, and some were already on the start line.
An attack could target Basra and proceed up alongside the Euphrates towards the strategic cities of Nasariya, Najaf and Karbala.
Tony Blair said he believed all MPs, irrespective of their views on the war, now wished British troops well.
"I know everyone in this House wishes our Armed Forces well," he said in the Commons.
A sandstorm whipped across northern Kuwait as the pace of preparations suddenly quickened Kuwaiti security sources disclosed that allied troops move into the demilitarised zone, which straddles the Iraq-Kuwait border, at around 11am local time, 8am UK time.
The source, working in the Umm Qasr area in the east of the zone, said: "American convoys are still driving towards Umm Qasr."
A US military spokesman said he could not confirm or deny that troops were inside the zone.
A British Army spokesman said only that soldiers had taken up " forward battle positions".
At Fairford, 14 giant American B52 bombers which will lead the fight against Saddam were loaded up with cruise missiles this morning.
The first flight of B52s were expected to take off two hours before sunset to give them enough flying time to identify their targets and drop their first devastating payload before heading for home.
The missiles were driven to the aircraft in five articulated lorries escorted by police at 10.30am.
Troops meticulously loaded the weapons - each costing around £1million - into the bomb bays by forklift truck.
With an estimated flight time of only six hours to Iraq the bombers are expected to play a huge part in the initial air bombardment. A single B52 can deliver a payload of more than 70,000lb at a range of 8,800 miles without being refuelled. They are likely to take up positions over the Mediterranean or the Red Sea to unleash cruise missiles or satelliteguided smart bombs. RAF Tornados, Harriers and Jaguars are also likely to be involved in the opening 48-hour offensive.
The Tornados will be given the specific task of taking out air defences and barracks round small missile batteries and air strips in the Iraqi desert.
This will enable the enemy positions to be quickly seized by airborne forces and turned into bases for the advancing allied armies.
The Harrier force of up to 20 planes has the job of supporting special forces, the SAS and Special Boat Service and American Rangers in the hunt for Scud missile sites and any artillery shells with chemical warheads. Intelligence suggests Saddam has given his generals personal authority to unleash the deadly weapons as a last desperate measure to hold the Allies off from attacking Baghdad.
The mainstay of the bombing attack will be the 750 American and British fighter bombers from Gulf bases and the six American aircraft carriers now at battle stations in the Mediterranean and the Arabian Sea.
The aircraft, including RAF Tornados and Harriers, F16s, F15s and F18 Hornets will work on a "taxi rank" basis, forming ranks in the air before being sent in on targets. Along with the B52s from Fairford, other longrange bombers include the almost mythical B2 Spirit bat-wing supersonic aircraft which will fly from bases on Diego Garcia. Also spearheading the attack will be B1B Lancer and F117 Stealth bombers.
Action began in the air today as warplanes from the USS Abraham Lincoln bombed Iraqi positions after coalition aircraft - including two RAF Harrier jets - were fired on by Iraqi forces.
"There were, yesterday, four firings against our aircraft flying in the southern no-fly zone," Rear Admiral John Kelly told reporters on board the Lincoln. He said US forces had responded by bombing "a series of targets" he described as "command and control" positions.
unclehobart
New Member
I think we've hit the chest pushing stage of a bar fight just before someone starts swinging punches.
unclehobart
New Member
3:25 to go. Fire up your grills now and the roast might just be ready for game time.
unclehobart
New Member
8pm EST means what in Iraq? about 5am over there? I think they may let it go another day so we can start off with the stealth planes and general bombing in deep darkness of midnight ... but then I think were also looking at a near full moon ... so that advantage would be reduced.
HeXp£Øi±
Well-Known Member
Might be right, that would only leave us a couple hours of darkness. However i'm sure the white house thought about this when they decided to give the 48hr ultimatum at 4pm our time. If they were worried about darkness as a cover they could have made the statement at 12pm eastern time instead. Might be simply that they're not concerned about darkness since it's a full moon or they might just not be in any big hurry.
unclehobart
New Member
79 million viewers tuned in at the 8pm slot. A noon speech would have been all of 40 or so.
unclehobart
New Member
If they're smart, they'll corral the news monkeys for the first hour.