US history questions, south-north

Luis G

<i><b>Problemator</b></i>
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In the spirit of learning some, I have a few questions.

The south wanted to separate from the then Union, why?
Did the french supported the south/north?
Why the north didn't want the south to leave?
When did the conflict started and when and how did it end? (I'm guessing 1800s...)
Dixie, is that a person, place, movement??
 
I thought of asking this a while ago, but since flavio was around I decided not to just to keep the peace in here.
 
Luis G said:
In the spirit of learning some, I have a few questions.

The south wanted to separate from the then Union, why?
Did the french supported the south/north?
Why the north didn't want the south to leave?
When did the conflict started and when and how did it end? (I'm guessing 1800s...)
Dixie, is that a person, place, movement??

I'll go the short way. I'm sure SnP's explination will beat anything I can give.
-State's rights, tariffs, and of course, slavery played a role.
-They almost supported the South, as well as England, until the battle at Sharpsburg.
-Economic purposes. King Cotton brought in a good deal of national revenue.
-It can be argued that it started way back with the framers of the Constitution, but for the most part the 1850s were quite active in North/South agression: bleeding Kansas, John Brown's raid, etc. Still hasn't ended.
-It's everything.
 
1. Most think it was about slavery...it was an issue, but the predominant factor was federal rights vs. states rights

2. The French (and British) supported the South because of their need for the South's cotton...once they realized the Egyptian market, the Europeans backed off their support

3. The north saw the secession as unconstitutional, and did not want to lose the territory and population...in all fairness, Lincoln wanted to preserve the United States at all costs

4. April 12, 1861-April 9, 1865

5. An idea, a place, a way of life
 
Luis G said:
In the spirit of learning some, I have a few questions.

The south wanted to separate from the then Union, why?
Did the french supported the south/north?
Why the north didn't want the south to leave?
When did the conflict started and when and how did it end? (I'm guessing 1800s...)
Dixie, is that a person, place, movement??

I'll do my best to keep the vitriol out of it, but no promises.

1. Take your pick. Unfair tarriffs designed to line the New England industrial pockets while keeping the Southern states poor. States' rights, particularly over the issue of slavery but over many other bones of contention as well. Unfair representation in a central government that no longer represented Southern economic interests. Lack of railroad/industrial development. And there is one more key reason, which I hesitate to go into in open forum, but can provide more than ample documentation of its validity. I will mention it in passing and wait for Gonz to chime in, but never for one second discount the reality of it: The north hated the South, always had, and to this day still does. It's cultural, and goes back to Europe. There. I said it.

2. The French as well as the British verbally supported the Confederacy, but wanted slavery abolished first. The Confederacy ran out of time.

3. See answer 1. They didn't want to kill the cash cow. You can't grow cotton in Vermont ya know. As long as they got their raw goods cheaper than importing them, they weren't about to let us go. But they got greedy...or rather, had always BEEN greedy, and wanted to tax the Southern goods also. They wanted the money from both ends. Luckily for them, their bought and paid for president, the only dictator in the history of this nation, a wormy slimy little despot with a cute hat gave them everything they wanted and sacrificed the citizens of the Southern states as fodder for the northern industrial furnaces. Some hero.

4. The first shots were fired at Fort Sumter, but the conflict began years earlier. Some argue that it began as soon as the settlers got off the boat. New England and Dixie are settled by two distinctly different groups of immigrants who hated each other for generations. You do the math.

5. Dixie is a name, a place, and an attitude. It is a term used to refer to the Old South. We still use it as a means of defiance and identification. I can say I'm from Tennessee all day long, and 100 people will have 100 different interpretations of that. I say I'm from Dixie, and 98 of them get the same message.



Anything further, PM me. I'll give you more info than you want, and links to prove any of it you want.
 
Luckily for them, their bought and paid for president, the only dictator in the history of this nation, a wormy slimy little despot with a cute hat gave them everything they wanted and sacrificed the citizens of the Southern states as fodder for the northern industrial furnaces.

you did great until there as far as keeping the vitriol out.
 
1. what was the slavery issue? is it true that the southerns didn't want to abolish slavery?
4. Did the south surrender, or did they get an agreement? was there a final battle which decided everything, where, when?
5. So Dixie is quite a thing, any hints as to why it became a word with so much meaning? what are its origins?
 
Luis G said:
1. what was the slavery issue? is it true that the southerns didn't want to abolish slavery?
4. Did the south surrender, or did they get an agreement? was there a final battle which decided everything, where, when?
5. So Dixie is quite a thing, any hints as to why it became a word with so much meaning? what are its origins?

1. The slavery issue was simple. It was legal. Everywhere. Lincoln's ballyhooed Emancipation Proclamation freed only Southern slaves...in other words, slaves in territories outside his authority to free. Those inside the Union states - the ones he could have freed anytime he wanted to - were still slaves. In reality, it was a thinly veiled attempt to get Southern slaves to "rise up" and fight for the Union. It failed miserably.

Northern attitude toward blacks, free or slave, can be evidenced as much by what they didn't do as it can by what they did. Laws forbidding blacks, free or slave, from living in northern states were common. Fugitive slaves were returned south to their owners. They flat out didn't care what happened to slaves as long as they didn't live next door. How this translated into the myth of a caring, altruistic population of right thinking people is beyond me, but it did.

From a Southern perspective, it was economics and states' rights. The northern states which HAD abolished slavery made damn sure they sold all their slaves south first, thereby recouping their precious dollars before being forced to take the loss they wanted to hand to the Southern slave owners. Convenient, huh? Let us sell ours, then we'll outlaw it and leave you holding the bag, thus extending the fiscal rift between us and ensuring your continued relianc eon us for manufactured goods at whatever price we set while we tax your raw materials.

Slick, I gotta admit.

4. General Lee surrendered the Confederate Army at Appomattox Courthouse.

5. The meaning attached to the word Dixie is transposed from the depth of emotion Southerners felt for the Confederacy. They fought for it, suffered for it, and died for it. When the war was over, most were bitter. The rest soon were when "Reconstruction" began. Reconstruction was little more than the adding of insult to injury. It has been said that the only time America opposed a people fighting for their own freedom from oppressive government was when it was her own people fighting. Those who support the yankee myth of history avoid that statement like the plague. Go figure.
 
but they always taught me in grade school that the northerners were just morally better because they fought against the racist south!

what a buncha shit... as if anything that motivates state-level aggression is that simple...
 
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