What is racial profiling?

[RDX]

Guess you've never heard of the KKK, the neo-nazi's, the skin-heads, brown-shirts, etc...

Ah ha! And what do these groups focus around? Their race! Obviously membership to these groups is related to their race, so race must play a role in determining criminal activity, right?

So the money protects their criminal behavior. You didn't say it, but it's been implied. That, also, speaks volumes. It means that the more money you have, the less likely you are to be accused of criminal intent. That idea is extremely wrong.

Yes, money definetly can mask criminal behavior in many cases. I'm not saying it's right either.

All members of society are capable of criminal action, just as all members of society are capable of altruistic and noble sacrifice.

Yes, but some members are MORE inclined to commit criminal actions than others.

It looks to me as though you're inexperienced in racial interaction, and that's the reason you don't see the world the same way I see it.

Because you are ALWAYS right aren't you. And what is the solution to this problem? That law enforcement departments spend the same amount of resources investigating everyone? For every cop that's questioning residents of an inner city neighborhood about a homocide, there should be another cop in a nursing home interrogating the residents about their involvment in the murder? For every CIA spook that's keeping tabs on the movements of a 24 year old Iranian male who just arrived in NYC there should be anther CIA agent trailing you as you drive to work?

If you are arguing that it should just be more fair, then how does one go about to rectify that matter? Are cops in a certain city required to pull over a certain number of White, Black, Asian, Spanish...drivers each month? The number would be based upon the demographics of that city. So with a day left in the month, a cop looks at his tally for that month. He sees that he hasn't been pulling over enough Asian drivers. Therefore, for the next 8 hours he sits on the side of the road and looks for Asian drivers passing by. If he sees one, the lights go on. He continues to do this until he quota is met. Does that sound like a good system to you?

 

[MrBishop]

I'd say that this discussion is getting a wee bit out of hand. RDX is claiming that racial profiling is warranted because of it's statistical significance, Gato is claiming that the statistics are squewed by either the press or the police in an attempt to warrant their racist behavior.

I've seen a few numbers bandied about, but nothing really concrete.
I found this just now.

Prevalence of imprisonment in the United States

• As of December 31, 2001, there were an estimated 5.6 million adults who had ever served time in State or Federal prison, including 4.3 million former prisoners and 1.3 million adults in prison.
• Nearly a third of former prisoners were still under correctional supervision, including 731,000 on parole, 437,000 on probation, and 166,000 in local jails.
• In 2001, an estimated 2.7% of adults in the U.S. had served time in prison, up from 1.8% in 1991 and 1.3% in 1974.
• The prevalence of imprisonment in 2001 was higher for
  -- black males (16.6%) and Hispanic males (7.7%) than for white males (2.6%)
  -- black females (1.7%) and Hispanic females (0.7%) than white females (0.3%)
• Nearly two-thirds of the 3.8 million increase in the number of adults ever incarcerated between 1974 and 2001 occurred as a result of an increase in first incarceration rates; one-third occurred as a result of an increase in the number of residents age 18 and older.

[font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Lifetime likelihood of going to State or Federal prison[/font]

• [font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][size=-1]If recent incarceration rates remain unchanged, an estimated 1 of every 15 persons (6.6%) will serve time in a prison during their lifetime.[/size][/font]
• [font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][size=-1]Lifetime chances of a person going to prison are higher for [/size][/font][font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][size=-1]-- men (11.3%) than for women (1.8%) [/size][/font][font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][size=-1]-- blacks (18.6%) and Hispanics (10%) than for whites (3.4%)
  
  [/size][/font]
• [font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][size=-1]Based on current rates of first incarceration, an estimated 32% of black males will enter State or Federal prison during their lifetime, compared to 17% of Hispanic males and 5.9% of white males.

• 
  
  Now...statistically...blacks and hispanics spend more time in jail, have greater odds of going to jail, and get arrested more often. This is statistically significant, especially considering the low percentage of the population which is black or hispanic. The question is... are more black people in jail because they commit more crimes or because they are targeted more often, and therefore more likely to get caught than their white counterparts?[/size][/font]

• [font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][size=-1]Women were 10% of the local jail inmates in 1996, unchanged from 1989.
  [/size][/font]
• [font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][size=-1]Forty-eight percent of jailed women reported having been physically or sexually abused prior to admission; 27% had been raped.
  [/size][/font]
• [font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][size=-1]Sixty-three percent of jail inmates belonged to racial or ethnic minorities in 1996, up slightly from 61% in 1989.
  [/size][/font]
• [font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][size=-1]Twenty-four percent of jail inmates were between the ages of 35 and 44 in 1996, up from 17% in 1989.
  [/size][/font]
• [font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][size=-1]Over a third of all inmates reported some physical or mental disability [/size][/font]
• [font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][size=-1]About 8% of local jail inmates were not U.S. citizens.
  [/size][/font]
• [font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][size=-1]Altogether, 54% of inmates had a high school diploma or its equivalent.
  [/size][/font]
• [font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][size=-1]Thirty-six of all inmates were not employed during the month before they were arrested for their current offense -- 20% were looking for work; 16% were not looking.
  [/size][/font]
• [font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][size=-1]Among the local jail inmates in 1996: [/size][/font][font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][size=-1]-- a fourth were held for a violent crime [/size][/font][font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][size=-1]-- a fourth were held for a property crime [/size][/font][font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][size=-1]-- about a fifth were held for a drug crime [/size][/font]
• [font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][size=-1]More than 7 of every 10 jail inmates had prior sentences to probation or incarceration.
  [/size][/font]
• [font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]A quarter of the jail inmates said they had been treated at some time for a mental or emotional problem.

• [/font]

[font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]They also mention education levels and employment in this stastical array. People with lower levels of education, or either without a job or poor are more likely to commit crimes. There are higher numbers of racial minorities in poor areas (Ghettos if you will). There are higher crime rates in poor areas. [/font]

[font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]I'm looking for concrete numbers here. Gato...you're stating that more white people commit crimes than black people, and therefore the racial profiling is really racism profiling. Can you provide links?[/font]

[font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]In other ne[/font]

Violent victimizations, 1992-96

Number of violent
victimizations per 1,000
persons age 12 or older**

All races 50
American Indian 124
Black 61
White 49
Asian 29

**Average annual rate, 1992-96

* American Indians* experience per capita rates of violence
which are more than twice those of the U.S. resident population.
(*Include Alaska Natives and Aleuts. Asians include Hawaiian
Natives and Pacific Islanders.)

Seems like my race should be more profiled than others... can I see more cases of DWN soon?

 

[Professur]

I'd just like to point out that statistics can, and do, tell you whatever you're looking for. You just have to ask the right questions.

 

[Gato_Solo]

Ah ha! And what do these groups focus around? Their race! Obviously membership to these groups is related to their race, so race must play a role in determining criminal activity, right?

It's what you said reversed, and now you're upset. Too bad, but that's the way it is.

Yes, money definetly can mask criminal behavior in many cases. I'm not saying it's right either.

At least you can admit something wrong is going on...

Yes, but some members are MORE inclined to commit criminal actions than others.

If I watched you 24/7, I'm sure I could arrest you, personally, on a few things as well. Does that mean that you are more criminally inclined than your neighbor? No. It means that you are targeted more, so you seem to be more criminally inclined. Don't mix what you want to see with what is actually there.

Because you are ALWAYS right aren't you. And what is the solution to this problem? That law enforcement departments spend the same amount of resources investigating everyone? For every cop that's questioning residents of an inner city neighborhood about a homocide, there should be another cop in a nursing home interrogating the residents about their involvment in the murder? For every CIA spook that's keeping tabs on the movements of a 24 year old Iranian male who just arrived in NYC there should be anther CIA agent trailing you as you drive to work?

1. I'm not always right, and if you think that, then I must be pretty close to the truth in this thread.

2. Yes. Law enforcement should spend the same amount of time on Wall street that it does in 'Alphabet City'. You make yourself look bad by using the nursing home, however there are still quite a few unsolved crimes in the US that have been 'left over' for quite a few years. Perhaps a sweep of a nursing home, or two, would get something.

3. The CIA is for foreign intelligence only. They, by mandate, are not allowed to operate inside the US. As for the agents trailing me to work...on any given day I get followed by 2, sometimes 3 different police cars. This isn't paranoia. It's the truth. I've had them come out of side streets and ride right up onto my bumper, and stay there for 3, or 4, miles sometimes. Not passing, and turning when I turn. I've enven had people speed past me with the cop on my ass, and nothing happens. You're so tuned into who's criminal and who isn't, explain that.

If you are arguing that it should just be more fair, then how does one go about to rectify that matter? Are cops in a certain city required to pull over a certain number of White, Black, Asian, Spanish...drivers each month? The number would be based upon the demographics of that city. So with a day left in the month, a cop looks at his tally for that month. He sees that he hasn't been pulling over enough Asian drivers. Therefore, for the next 8 hours he sits on the side of the road and looks for Asian drivers passing by. If he sees one, the lights go on. He continues to do this until he quota is met. Does that sound like a good system to you?

I don't think you mean that, because that, in itself, is a rather naive, and stupid thing to say. But the system we have now is definitely skewed away from what's fair, and you seem to think that's okay. How about this...If somebody is doing something illegal, the cops stop them. Not based on suspicion, not based on neighborhood, and not based on race. Sounds better, doesn't it?