All of this hoopla...

[Gonz]

...over 16 words. Out of approcimately 2300 directly referring to the war on terror.

The British government has learned that Saddam Hussein recently sought significant quantities of uranium from Africa.

He told us up front that the intel was not ours. The Brits & the Americans say there is more intel available that has not been made public. There is only one way to find out-time. If those have been clasified then they won't be released.

The two mobile lab trucks that were found...were they the latest things in Ice Cream vendors?

The chemicals that have been located all over the place...are they purely overdoing pesticides in Iraq?

What did Bush know & when did he know it? That was asked within days, if not hours, of the attacks. "He didn't properly respond to intel" was among the arguments. NOw that he has intel & it's not fitting on his oppositions plate just right, they say he's a liar. Well ya know what, he had information & used it. Don't like it?

As soon as I'm shown a piece of evidence that this administration blatantly lied to the public, I'll join you. Until then, it's all political horseshit.

DAmned if you do & damned if you don't.

 

[Squiggy]

You posted ten times more 'hoopla' before the war when we were saying 'until he shows proof instead of inuendo its all political bullshit' and we were labled all kinds of things for it. Now that his story is falling apart, you want us to sit back and wait like good little children...What is it that you don't get? You kept saying "all sadam has to do is show us and this would be over". Well now its "Wmd's turn to "show us and this will all be over. Doesn't it fucking matter to you that thousands of lives were lost over what is apparently turning out to be a bunch of lies masking a personal agenda?

Sorry Gonz, but the whole world is waking up while you're napping....or pretending to be asleep.

 

[Gonz]

Review history Squiggy. There have been many many times that "persons in power" have been, as it was later learned, mislabeled. Good & bad. Since we don't have all the facts, we don't know squat. The entire world knows Iraq was armed. The only facts missing are where are they now? Destroyed? Present evidence. Hidden? Find them. Given away? To whom? Answers will turn up. He was given 14 months to dispose of teh evidence. We need more than 3 months to figure out how.

You keep spouting numbers of casualties. Why is it okay for Hussein to murder & maim? The US is doing the right thing.

 

[Squiggy]

I, for one was NEVER convinced that Iraq was armed. Which is why I felt there were other agendas that he was hiding. The world knew Sadam was an asshole, but not that he was armed. That was what Bush fed us to get his way and allow him to have his war...And if I thought for a minute that you gave Clinton the benefit of the doubt in any of the whitewater/Monica investigation, I may do the same for you. But you know thats not what you did. Difference is, this shit costs a lot of lives. The $40 Million blowjob didn't. Its quite simple...If Bush had/has the proof, SHOW US NOW.

 

[flavio]

But the CIA, sensing once again it might become a scapegoat, leaked its own take on the affair to the Washington Post, stressing that the CIA had gone so far as to warn the British that “State Department analysts were questioning its accuracy when it came to Niger and that CIA personnel considered reports on other African countries to be ‘sketchy.’”

The State Department, the military officer corps and many CIA officials were very wary of the idea of an invasion of Iraq and skeptical of intelligence painting Saddam as a “clear and present danger” to the United States even as Osama bin Laden remained at large.

Greg Thielmann, who ran military assessments at the State Department’s Bureau of Intelligence and Research until October, said intelligence clearly was manipulated to make the most hawkish case possible for war. He told Congress at the same hearing Rumsfeld attended that data on the Iraqi threat was “misrepresented on the part of the administration.”

Even before the African uranium charge was withdrawn, leaks from U.S. and British intelligence agencies had raised questions about whether the administration jury-rigged prewar intelligence to paint a far more threatening picture of Iraq’s arsenal than data otherwise suggested.

In May, sensing a gathering storm over the “missing” WMD, U.S. intelligence analysts began leaking complaints to U.S. news outlets suggesting that they were pressured to “bury,” in the words of one, any analysis that did not support the most alarmist view of the Iraqi threat.

In early June, two strangely outfitted trailers were discovered that seemed to fit the description of the “mobile biological weapons labs” Powell accused the Iraqis of operating in a February speech to the U.N. Security Council. No weapons material was found in the trailers, however, and within two weeks, unnamed U.S. intelligence officials had told the Washington Post that the administration suppressed analysts’ reports that concluded the trailers were likely to have been just what the Iraqis claimed they were: support trailers used to inflate weather balloons.

“This was a war made in Washington, pushed by a handful of neoconservatives and pursued for reasons of U.S. foreign strategy and domestic politics,” Cook wrote in the London daily The Independent on Friday. Cook’s broadside coincided with new statements from anonymous British Cabinet members saying they now had very little expectation that any banned weapons would ever be found in Iraq.

I don't know how it is that you don't feel silly defending these crooks, but you just keep falling for their crap again and again.

 

[Gonz]

12/16/98

"Earlier today I ordered America's armed forces to strike military and security targets in Iraq. They are joined by British forces," Clinton said.

"Their mission is to attack Iraq's nuclear, chemical and biological weapons programs and its military capacity to threaten its neighbors," said Clinton.

Clinton also stated that, while other countries also had weapons of mass destruction, Hussein is in a different category because he has used such weapons against his own people and against his neighbors.

 

[Squiggy]

What the fuck does that have to do with any fucking thing?... Bush was in office all of 4 days when he launched his first strike against Iraq to try to provoke something...You're really starting to baffle me, Gonz...

 

[Gonz]

02/17/98

Then and only then did Iraq admit to developing numbers of weapons in significant quantities and weapon stocks. Previously, it had vehemently denied the very thing it just simply admitted once Saddam Hussein's son-in-law defected to Jordan and told the truth. Now listen to this, what did it admit?

It admitted, among other things, an offensive biological warfare capability notably 5,000 gallons of botulinum, which causes botulism; 2,000 gallons of anthrax; 25 biological-filled Scud warheads; and 157 aerial bombs.

Over the past few months, as they have come closer and closer to rooting out Iraq's remaining nuclear capacity,

The UNSCOM inspectors believe that Iraq still has stockpiles of chemical and biological munitions, a small force of Scud-type missiles, and the capacity to restart quickly its production program and build many, many more weapons.

Now, let's imagine the future. What if he fails to comply, and we fail to act, or we take some ambiguous third route which gives him yet more opportunities to develop this program of weapons of mass destruction and continue to press for the release of the sanctions and continue to ignore the solemn commitments that he made?

Well, he will conclude that the international community has lost its will. He will then conclude that he can go right on and do more to rebuild an arsenal of devastating destruction.

And some day, some way, I guarantee you, he'll use the arsenal. And I think every one of you who's really worked on this for any length of time believes that, too.

 

[Gonz]

I, for one was NEVER convinced that Iraq was armed. Which is why I felt there were other agendas that he was hiding.

There is a small sampling of Bush's agenda. Clinton was apparently involved.

 

[Squiggy]

I think ol man got ahold of Gonz's password....

 

[flavio]

There is a small sampling of Bush's agenda. Clinton was apparently involved.

Next time you get pulled over for speeding try telling the cop that you saw someone else speeding a week ago and see how this line of reasoning works.

 

[Gonz]

Next time you get pulled over for speeding try telling the cop that you saw someone else speeding a week ago and see how this line of reasoning works.

So we're back to square one. Why was it okay for Willie to attack & Bush is evil incarnate for doing what needed to be done?

 

[Squiggy]

Do you not realize the difference between a surgical strike and what Bush instigated? And there is a THREE YEAR time span involved...You're not making any sense...

 

[Gonz]

Yes I realize the difference. A surgical strike may take care of the problem Deposing a leader DOES take care of it. Three years is a long time to make new weapons.

I'm supposed to make sense? Now you tell me.

 

[Inkara1]

Difference is, this shit costs a lot of lives. The $40 Million blowjob didn't.

If we want to talk about a president costing lives, this is some old but very interesting reading.

 

[flavio]

The goal here being to focus on anything but the current issue right?

 

[Squiggy]

ol man has everyone's password.....Try sticking to the fucking subject. This ain't about Clinton no matter how hard you try.

 

[Squiggy]

HERE you go, Inky...You don't even want to get me started on Bush links...trust me.

 

[ris]

there were many who asked that the un weapons inspectors be given a proper time to get in and do their job. there appears to be some credence to the idea that the inspectors were doing a pretty good job of holding hussein's arsenal in check [blix certainly beleived that the inspectors were achieving results].

now we are being told to give proper time to the next bunch of inspectors who are going in - the intelligence was so good before that we were told the inspectors wouldn't achieve anything. now the intel was so bad it doesn't know where to go looking.

i see no reason to give benfits of time to those who would not give it themselves.

in the uk we have noticed a very specific shift in language. in january we were told of weapons ready to fire at moments notice, of arsenals ready to go. now we are reminded that the programs will be found. certainly looks like a tacit admission that the weapons are few and far between - one moment an unstabling arsenal capable of minutes launch, the next an ephemeral program whose constructs can be nothing more than suspicions and possibilites.

 

[Inkara1]

Wrong Bush, Squig. The pages of people who Dubya might have had killed don't start until Page 10, not Page 2 as was linked to.