The Liberals’ Creed

[markjs]

While you may defend tobbacco, I had that debate with Gonz I am sure of it.

 

[markjs]

I invited you because you are someone who'd opinion I respect even when I disagree. I invited the liberals at ABB because I thought this place could use a fresh opinion. I guess I was wrong.

As far as I can tell only two people from ABB have joined here. Only one has been very inflamatory. If you guys can't handle that I feel sorry for you.

If I really commited some big crime here I am truly sorry, but I just don't think it's that big of a deal.

 

[Larner]

>>"Come on, if you want to have an argument, have it! If you want to hear your own views repeated back to you verbatim, buy a parrot. But, if you're going to spout off about how much "integrity" you think this (p)Resident has and how morally upright and superior to us lowly mortals he is, then you had better be prepared to rebut my hard, cold, facts with some of your own."<<

You know, RW, that for the far-right conservative believers, there is no proof that Bush ever did anything wrong, no matter how blatent, even when Bush himself admits that there was never hard evidence of weapons of mass destruction sufficient to threaten the U.S., when he admits that there was no proof that Saddam was supporting Al Qaeda, and so on.

Bush has chosen to be an anti-intellectual, and his administration has demanded that they get unfiltered reports from the intelligence community, so they can pick and choose precisely those reports they will believe and those they will ignore. So, when the administration reported that Saddam had been purchasing weapons-grade nuclear material in Africa (based on a report graded very questionable), once it was pointed out in the press by another official that this was false because this official had actually checked it out before Bush's folk leaked it, they retaliated by giving the man's wife's name and identity as a member of the intelligence community to the press.

Bush as governor of Texas signed off on more death warrants than any other governor in the United States. When asked to cut the red tape to allow a wrongly convicted man out of prison once it was proven via DNA the man was innocent and another man already in custody for a similar offense had committed a brutal rape, Bush refused. When asked to allow a stay of eight hours to allow a man on death row to have DNA testing done to prove definitively if he was or not guilty, he refused--and it came out ONLY after the man had been executed that the prosecution in the case had already disposed of the questioned material.

Then, during the debates, Bush insisted that every person executed in Texas whose death warrants he signed deserved his or her fate. If he isn't honest enough to answer that question honestly--"It is possible that someone may have indeed been executed wrongly under my watch"--then I see him as a liar and an ideologue. Ideologues have no business being in charge of any political structure.

 

[Winky]

Liberals’ Screed

What markjs did was a crime of the highest order

or if not quite that heinous

at least it showed an intense dis-like for this board

maybe he's not edumahcated enough to defend his position
as well as woefully ignorant of even the simplest Internet protocols. Now I really welcomed Larner she would have provided hours of fun but these people he has invited to invade and spam troll and otherwise deface this board
that's just down right low as low as one could go!

<<I am not the most educated nor am I the most caught up with current events guys you'll see. I'd love to see some of you brilliant liberal minds take on the conservatives that dominate the board.>>

So far these ‘brilliant liberal minds’ don’t impress me one bit!

 

[Gato_Solo]

Someone documents the lies, and you don't accept them. What does this say about you, Gonz?

Most...well, hell...ALL of that document is speculation and taking statements out of context. Bet I could make Charles Manson look like he never hurt a fly if I mixed his words like that. I always like watching this kind of thing, though. Here we have one person who has decided that someone is a liar, and does everything they can to do just that. Let's just take an example of this, shall we...I'll be the person accused of being a liar, just so you'll get the entire point of this.

1. I've never been convicted of a crime.
2. Someone asks if I've ever been guilty of a crime, and I say, truthfully, no, knowing that I've been arrested before.
3. This person goes through court documents from 25 years ago, and finds out that I was arrested for drunk driving (never done it IRL...this is just an example), and proceeds to trumpet me as a liar because I was arrested for drunk driving, even though I was never convicted. In fact, the charges had been thrown out, but, now, the seeds of doubt are planted, so more people start looking. It's become a game to catch Gato in a mis-statement.
4. Later, this person asks if I've ever been arrested for a major crime, and I truthfully answer no, because, 25 years ago, drunk driving wasn't a major crime. Now I'm definitely a liar, because I won't come 'clean' on their accusations of being arrested on a major crime. Now they drop their bombshell by asking me if I had ever been convicted of drunk driving. Again I say no. They ask if I've ever been arrested for drunk driving, and, now, I'm in a position of looking like a drunken fool. Now I'm trapped, because if I answer their question with a "yes", they won't ask any more questions, as the vultures have now been sated. If I answer "no", then I actually am a liar, and if I answer "no comment", I'm avoiding the issue, and I will, once again, look like a drunken fool.

Now I'll ask you a question...Am I a liar, or am I now a victim of bias?

 

[Winky]

Liberals’ Screed

http://gwbush.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=9123&st=0

 

[markjs]

I intend to ignore you winky for the most part, but I feel this post demands a response. First of all I have no dislike for this board I merely thought it could use a few more "evil" as you would put it people (people leaning left). The people that joined did so on their own accord, and I have no control over which ones did.

I freely admit I am not the most learned or up on current events person. I have never said otherwise. I have my opinions and I argue them as best I might. I know there are other people who stay better on top of things and that is what I was seeking.

Personally I believe conservatives are wrong, but it's ridiculous to call liberals or conservatives evil. Nobody on either side is intent on hurting anyone, they merely think their ideas are right and the other side's are wrong.

 

[Larner]

I agree--Bush did end up getting somewhat manipulated about the drunk driving episode. What is ironic, however, is first that his record was cleaned up by his obtaining a new drivers license which was no longer tied to that arrest, something a common, ordinary soul could not do in the general run of things. But it appears be okay for Bush to flout the rules, but not other folk. Instead, Bush, who knows how vulnerable folk are to addiction and addictive behavior due to his own failings, has repeatedly supported strengthening punishments for those who use drugs. This demonstrates the man is a hypocrite at the very least.

He spent a good amount of time he was supposed to be serving in the Texas Air National Guard elsewhere, working on someone else's political bid. He was even jumped over the list into the TANG as a result of his position as Bush the Elder's son. Yet he has the gall to condemn those who question his non-logic and to insist they are not patriotic.

I am working to get Bush out of the White House--in the legal approved manner of encouraging my friends to get registered and vote the fool out. His economic policies have endangered my job and the education of children across the nation. His ideological policies lump all who need assistance into one large bunch--"They are failures and don't deserve any help." That many of those who now need help are in that position because Bush has failed to insist his own friends in Enron and other such scandals follow the law seems to escape the man.

 

[Winky]

Liberals’ Screed

markjs

Was that an apology?
If so it has been found totally deficient!

Jus so ya know BUDDY there are some folks on this board
that are less than pleased with what you've done.

Henceforth I will do to you what you've said you were going to do to me and deny your existence!

Heck I'd rather type to your Mom if she can ever stop talking to herself!

Bye Bye Buddy

 

[samcurry]

Mark i think only charlie has gotten out of line. I simply ask to attack a POST with fact and links to such. nothing else. but he continued to go after the poster.
Invite anyone youd like, the more here the more we all learn.
Its just easier to sway someone to your beliefs when you arent telling them they are stupid or ignorant.

 

[markjs]

Agreed Sam and really if anyone was hurt by my inviting those people I am sorry. If the guys gets too out of line he said it himself....ban him!

 

[samcurry]

he isnt banned just corraled in the KK for now. He can ask to be let out and post in here again if he can not attack the poster anytime he wishes.

 

[Gato_Solo]

I agree--Bush did end up getting somewhat manipulated about the drunk driving episode. What is ironic, however, is first that his record was cleaned up by his obtaining a new drivers license which was no longer tied to that arrest, something a common, ordinary soul could not do in the general run of things. But it appears be okay for Bush to flout the rules, but not other folk. Instead, Bush, who knows how vulnerable folk are to addiction and addictive behavior due to his own failings, has repeatedly supported strengthening punishments for those who use drugs. This demonstrates the man is a hypocrite at the very least.

So if you tell your children not to smoke, and you've got a cigarette in your hand (example), you are also a hypocrite? By definition, yes, but in practice, no.

He spent a good amount of time he was supposed to be serving in the Texas Air National Guard elsewhere, working on someone else's political bid. He was even jumped over the list into the TANG as a result of his position as Bush the Elder's son. Yet he has the gall to condemn those who question his non-logic and to insist they are not patriotic.

I'll cede you that with one caveat...Our previous president ran from the country to preserve his own ass, and berated all those who actually did serve.

I am working to get Bush out of the White House--in the legal approved manner of encouraging my friends to get registered and vote the fool out. His economic policies have endangered my job and the education of children across the nation. His ideological policies lump all who need assistance into one large bunch--"They are failures and don't deserve any help." That many of those who now need help are in that position because Bush has failed to insist his own friends in Enron and other such scandals follow the law seems to escape the man.

Good for you. I'm glad you're making an effort to fulfill your duty as a citizen of the US by voting. As for the rest of that, I'll take it one at a time.

1. Education is the job of each state...not the federal government. If you are having problems with budgets, classroom size, and/or classroom discipline, you should address those problems to your state government...not the feds. The president can say anything he wants on the subject of education, and it doesn't mean squat if the states don't follow the policy. One more thing, and I'll move on...If you have problem children in your class, you'll find that there are problem parents in that childs home.
2. Most people who are on assistance don't need it. The few who do deserve help are outnumbered, thus making the entire system a travesty. How can you justify your statement about failures with the system being overloaded with abusers?
3. Most people who are on some type of welfare were there even before the Enron scandal. My personal belief is that every executive on their board should be doing hard labor is something I've espoused here quite often.

 

[Gonz]

Someone documents the lies, and you don't accept them. What does this say about you, Gonz?

Before you question my integrity, please, have a look. Go back about 18 months. In this forum. My name is plastered on about 1/3 stories in the Real World. I have, over than span of time, diminished & proven false virtually every single argument both in the new thread & by the thousands of people that are smarter than the ones who post

there's no chance they could invade here i hope. I am registering in my name...

and I'm tired of rehashing what is already know to those who refuse to see.

 

[Leslie]

I have, over than span of time, diminished & proven false virtually every single argument both in the new thread & by the thousands of people that are smarter than the ones who post

or - can't decide

 

[Gonz]

I intend to ignore you winky for the most part, but I feel this post demands a response. First of all I have no dislike for this board I merely thought it could use a few more "evil" as you would put it people (people leaning left). The people that joined did so on their own accord, and I have no control over which ones did.

I will try to keep this as nice as I can given the state I'm in at the moment.

I AM the right at OTC. There are a few members that agree with me. Most do not. Most have not. Most will not. This board leans heavily to the center with a marked tilt towards the left. Most of them which agree with my ideology allow me the vice of being a pain in the ass. I enjoy the debate. I don't enjoy the arguments that occur between the admins & mods and myself, but it's the price I pay. Some members who haven't participated in a long time have recently re-joined the love fest we call OTC. They, like me, have a sincere & open distrust of all things socialist. They, like me, prefer open & honest debate where these clashes of ideals may happen. The difference between these members and the I hate Bush crowd is they have been members for more than 24 hours before attacking. They have continued to read posts, even when not posting & know the membership. The new crowd is more than welcome to join & participate. But I'll ask they not make me repeat myself ad infinitum.

 

[Gonz]

or - can't decide

oh hush

 

[Leslie]

k

 

[Gonz]

I had plans on invading Forums @GWBush. 25 posts of lies & innuendo would be a breeze after making a point to check my facts here. Well, after seeing the forum rules I decided they won't & can't waste any more of my time.

This is a strategy discussion forum for like-minded liberals and progressives. It exists for the purpose of providing an alternative to the debate forums that are abundant across the Internet. If you wish to debate, please go to the main gwbush.com page and choose the "slugfest" forum, as any anti-progressive or right-wing posts left on this board will be removed. Note: Threats against the president are illegal and will not be tolerated. Do it and you will be banned! While criticizm from a progressive viewpoint is welcome, that from a conservative viewpoint is not. Please respect our wishes and post on the proper forum.. Thanks, and happy posting.

Leslie-may I call these fools nazis?

 

[Leslie]

that policy sure is close ain't it.

*wondering what/where the slugfest forum is*

I have no hope that my post over there will be actually posted, considering one of the people involved here is a moderator over there