another post about gay marriages... but this one might make you go "hmmmm"...

PT said:
I've been married myself twice now, I know what it takes to make a marraige work.
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To make Rose happy I'll quote the best part & let it stand on its own.
 
MrBishop said:
PC=Personal Computer - and yes, Macintosh makes personal computers, using a different operating system, much like Linux is an OS. The term PC has been attributed to personal computers which run on the Windows OS, but regardless of which OS it runs on...a PC is a PC is a PC.

A MAC is a PC :) It's just not a WindowsOS PC.

A Marriage is a Marriage is a Marriage. Wether performed in a church or at the JOP. One is 'blessed' and the other isn't, but it's still a Marriage.
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bish, shaddup :D I said REAL PC

your right though, a marriage is a marriage, why change it?
 
ResearchMonkey said:
Tolerance is a virtue, and since you do not have the strength of mind accept that I have my own principled values, you’re intolerant.
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And you don't have the strength of mind to consider an opposing point of view either, so that makes you what?

As for enlightened, you feel your typical life experiences give you some moral authority to address these issues because you have met gay people? I don’t know that that qualifies you as enlightened since your expertise and training have no exceptional qualities that can shed new light to the unenlightened.
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My life experiences include growing up with a gay uncle, a gay brother, and several friends of my mothers that were gay. It also included hearing about them talk about how they would love to get married, to be able to make a commitment like that. Yes, they do make commitments, but it's not legally recognized commitments, so there is something cheaper about it. If it wasn't, marriage wouldn't exist at all.

I on the other hand have spent thousands of hour discussing very personal issues of homosexuality with homosexuals in groups and individually. Not to mention many many hours of homosexual issue and sensitivity training.
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Thousands of hours discussing personal issues with homosexuals? Please, do tell.
 
ResearchMonkey said:
bish, shaddup :D I said REAL PC

your right though, a marriage is a marriage, why change it?
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The Mac is a better PC than the PC, ya know :D

What I was getting at, is that wether its in the church of at the JOP, it should bear equal weight legally and both should bear the same terminology.

Why bother coming up with another term for the same relationship? There are those who would say that it's all a terminology issue. That if the gays jsut called it an Union instead of a Marriage, there wouldn't be an issue. My point is that there likewise whouldn't be an issue with the use of the term Marriage.

What I can't seem to wrap my brain around is how any of this in any way lessens your own Maraige or the marriage of anyone else. Your neighbour's marriage shouldn't affect yours, his infidelity doesn't make you infidel with your wife, his divorce doesn't make you want to divorce... right?

So, why should the Marriage of someone you're not likely to meet affect you, your marraige and indeed..your definition of marriage?
 
MrBishop said:
The Mac is a better PC than the PC, ya know :D

What I was getting at, is that wether its in the church of at the JOP, it should bear equal weight legally and both should bear the same terminology.

Why bother coming up with another term for the same relationship? There are those who would say that it's all a terminology issue. That if the gays jsut called it an Union instead of a Marriage, there wouldn't be an issue. My point is that there likewise whouldn't be an issue with the use of the term Marriage.

What I can't seem to wrap my brain around is how any of this in any way lessens your own Maraige or the marriage of anyone else. Your neighbour's marriage shouldn't affect yours, his infidelity doesn't make you infidel with your wife, his divorce doesn't make you want to divorce... right?

So, why should the Marriage of someone you're not likely to meet affect you, your marraige and indeed..your definition of marriage?
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Perhaps you've just shown your hand, my friend. You continually refer to your live-in girlfriend, and mother of your child as your wife, or missus. She is neither, but the destinction, for you, is irrelevant. Not for the rest of us. Therefore, your definition of marriage differs sharply from mine. Yours seems to be an etheral, hazy conceptual thing, while mine is the concrete solid basis for the remainder of my life, and the foundation for my kids to build upon.
 
mk...so are we all happily discussing Gay whatever blahblah, or are we discussing each other in here?
 
Leslie said:
mk...so are we all happily discussing Gay whatever blahblah, or are we discussing each other in here?
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We're discussing wether homosexuals should have the right to marry. If discussing that, the issue of what marriage is comes up. I simply pointed out that someone for whom marriage is no-big-thing, it's a non-issue. Frankly, living in the city, I don't give a rat's ass about where they put pig farms. But the people living beside them sure do. And that I don't care about their farms, homes, and environments being ruined ....

get it?
 
wasn't talkin to you particularly, my post just happened to fall after yours :p

twas more the intricate shredding of all comers' debating skills I was poking at
 
PuterTutor said:
And you don't have the strength of mind to consider an opposing point of view either, so that makes you what?

Thousands of hours discussing personal issues with homosexuals? Please, do tell.
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I have considered the ramifications of being homosexual, time and time again, I have personally come to the conclusion it causes a person far more problems than the heterosexual living does.

Well, let’s just say that there have been many a homosexual that has eagerly sought to spend thier hours sitting and talking with me.
 
Professur said:
Perhaps you've just shown your hand, my friend. You continually refer to your live-in girlfriend, and mother of your child as your wife, or missus. She is neither, but the destinction, for you, is irrelevant. Not for the rest of us. Therefore, your definition of marriage differs sharply from mine. Yours seems to be an etheral, hazy conceptual thing, while mine is the concrete solid basis for the remainder of my life, and the foundation for my kids to build upon.
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You're saying that my relationship isn't concrete or solid? That my relationship with my common-law spouse is any less faithful, loving, nurturing or solid than yours? That my son is less because of my lack of the term 'marriage' associated with my relationship?

Best get your asbestos underwear out if you're wanting to step into that particular battle, buddy. Even if MrsBish doesn't get word of it...if she does...I doubt a titanium body-condom would help.
 
Ah, you see. I wasn't talking your relationship. I was talking your opinion of "marriage". Your relationship, obviously, has nothing to do with marriage.

My point was exactly that. You're talking a long term relationship. I'm talking about marriage. You fail to see a difference between the two. I see it quite clearly.

A relationship, by definition, is an association of two seperate, distinct entities. A relationship defines how they relate (hence the use of the word). Easily returned to it's composite parts.

A marriage is a joining of two seperate, distinct entities, into a new whole. No long two, but one. Inseperable.

See the difference? If not, don't worry. It seems few others do either, today.


As for Mrs. Bish ???? Was that a Freudian slip, or deliberate taunting?
 
Ok, be it JOP or in a church I see it as marriage...marriage is the joinign of two people forever...is it marriage if it's commonlaw? Not in my mind and I've already expressed that I think commonlaw is BS and people should just suck it up and go to a JOP at the very least if they wanna be bound...if it's in a church though it is "Holy Matrimony" and JOP is NOT
 
If a person, or a couple, choose to live outside the bounds of what society regards as normal, should society be forced to accept them as such, regardless of their beliefs? If so, then what are the limits, and consequences, of such acceptance? Idealism is nice to have, but reality often rears it's head long after the idealism has been proven to be beneficial or harmful.
 
Professur said:
Ah, you see. I wasn't talking your relationship. I was talking your opinion of "marriage". Your relationship, obviously, has nothing to do with marriage.

My point was exactly that. You're talking a long term relationship. I'm talking about marriage. You fail to see a difference between the two. I see it quite clearly.

A relationship, by definition, is an association of two seperate, distinct entities. A relationship defines how they relate (hence the use of the word). Easily returned to it's composite parts.

A marriage is a joining of two seperate, distinct entities, into a new whole. No long two, but one. Inseperable.

See the difference? If not, don't worry. It seems few others do either, today.

As for Mrs. Bish ???? Was that a Freudian slip, or deliberate taunting?
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Insepereable...I think not. Frankly..I've been Married and divorced. I've even toasted the fact that I got out of that Marriage, with you. Marriage is a type of relationship...two individuals who live together for long periods of time and grow into one. No slip of paper or fancy set of rings will change the outcome of that relationship one whit. Either the couple stays together or grows apart... slap on whatever terminology you want to the relationship...its the same, except in the eyes of the GVT which decides who may or may not get survivor benefits etc... there's a very good reason why many people choose merely to live together nowdays. The main difference between Married and common-law? The church blessing and the rigamarole that goes with it. I can't afford it now...may not be able to afford it for a while, but I get the feeling that the day after we get married...SFA will have changed with our relationship. Our parents might be happier for it...

"MrsBish"...neither taunting nor a slip. I've been referring to her as MrsBish in the same way as you refer to your kids as v.2 v.3 and v.4 it keeps her name off the internet and people know exactly about whom I am referring.
 
Nixy said:
Ok, be it JOP or in a church I see it as marriage...marriage is the joinign of two people forever...is it marriage if it's commonlaw?
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Is it stronger if its marriage and not common-law?

See...I know a couple that have bee together for 27 years. Nice pair. Loving, caring, fun-loving people. I love hanging with them. They have a son...he's 25 now..nice kid. We've had coffee on a few occasions. This couple V&G go on vacations together, work together (albeit different shifts), have a nice new condo, used to own an antique shoppe, they're often out having dinner, or goign to movies now that their son has moved out. They're coming to my BBQ.

They're not married though. Care to guess why not?
 
MrBishop said:
No slip of paper or fancy set of rings will change the outcome of that relationship one whit.
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Then why not legalize it & get married?
 
MrBishop said:
Insepereable...I think not. Frankly..I've been Married and divorced. I've even toasted the fact that I got out of that Marriage, with you. Marriage is a type of relationship...two individuals who live together for long periods of time and grow into one. No slip of paper or fancy set of rings will change the outcome of that relationship one whit. Either the couple stays together or grows apart... slap on whatever terminology you want to the relationship...its the same, except in the eyes of the GVT which decides who may or may not get survivor benefits etc... there's a very good reason why many people choose merely to live together nowdays. The main difference between Married and common-law? The church blessing and the rigamarole that goes with it. I can't afford it now...may not be able to afford it for a while, but I get the feeling that the day after we get married...SFA will have changed with our relationship. Our parents might be happier for it...

"MrsBish"...neither taunting nor a slip. I've been referring to her as MrsBish in the same way as you refer to your kids as v.2 v.3 and v.4 it keeps her name off the internet and people know exactly about whom I am referring.
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Yeah, I toasted the end of your marriage. But then, I'd tried (unsucessfully) to warn you off about your ex since .... well since before I ever met her. I distinctly recall the day. We were walking the dogs with Gordie. You were telling me about how you met. I stood up at your wedding, praying all the while that I'd be wrong.

Since you've never in your life listened to any advice I've ever given you (still smoking?) your divorce didn't exactly come as any great suprise. Neither does anything else you've said in this thread.
 
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