Forced Volenteering!

Altron said:
My time is valuable to me, and if I'm doing something I don't want to do, I had better receive adequate compensation. Simple as that. I'm not going to spend 100 hours doing something that I don't want to for free. I'd spend 100 hours doing something that I don't want to for $935 like I did at circuit no problem.
Click to expand...

1 - Community Service doesn't have involve changing old peoples diapers...most people can find something they enjoy to put their time towards. My family feels very strongly about fundraising for cancer research (my dad and grandfather both died because of cancer)...many of my younger cousins who have had to do community service to graduate have volunteered their time at various fundraising events. My brother even got some hours by participating in some walks to raise money for cancer research...it's something they feel strongly about and enjoyed doing.

2 - You're taking engineering right? You better change that additude if you want to go anywhere in life. Any engineers I know, and any engineering companies I've come across do not have a strict 9-5 structured work schedule. Deadlines come up, shit happens, and sometimes you work crazy hours and most of them do not pay overtime. It's a salaried position with minimum hours per week, but also the requirement that your responsibilities are taken care of. I've worked with people who take on the "I've worked my hours, I'm leaving" additude and they go nowhere fast. This of course isn't only true for engineering positions, but I believe that is your major...

3 - I hope you never need anyone to do anything for you...because newsflash, a lot of people don't enjoy doing all of the things they do for other people. They do them because they want to be helpful, because the person is their friend and they want to help them out. But, if you don't ever go out of your way and do things you don't want to do to help others then the chances of others going out of their way for your are slim.
 
Nixy said:
1 - Community Service doesn't have involve changing old peoples diapers...most people can find something they enjoy to put their time towards. My family feels very strongly about fundraising for cancer research (my dad and grandfather both died because of cancer)...many of my younger cousins who have had to do community service to graduate have volunteered their time at various fundraising events. My brother even got some hours by participating in some walks to raise money for cancer research...it's something they feel strongly about and enjoyed doing.

2 - You're taking engineering right? You better change that additude if you want to go anywhere in life. Any engineers I know, and any engineering companies I've come across do not have a strict 9-5 structured work schedule. Deadlines come up, shit happens, and sometimes you work crazy hours and most of them do not pay overtime. It's a salaried position with minimum hours per week, but also the requirement that your responsibilities are taken care of. I've worked with people who take on the "I've worked my hours, I'm leaving" additude and they go nowhere fast. This of course isn't only true for engineering positions, but I believe that is your major...

3 - I hope you never need anyone to do anything for you...because newsflash, a lot of people don't enjoy doing all of the things they do for other people. They do them because they want to be helpful, because the person is their friend and they want to help them out. But, if you don't ever go out of your way and do things you don't want to do to help others then the chances of others going out of their way for your are slim.
Click to expand...

JOKE ALERT: THE FOLLOWING IS A JOKE

First of all, how dare you bring this thread back on topic? How can we live up to the name of the website with people like you thwarting us at every turn?

THE PRECEDING WAS A JOKE

You said:
Maybe "volunteering" is the wrong word for it...but really, students are FORCED to learn math, english, science, etc. while in school, what is wrong with forcing them to perform community service?
Click to expand...

If it cannot be called volunteering then it must be called by what it is: forced servitude.

As for being "forced" to learn, any student can simply drop out of high school at any time they wish. No one will be dragging them back to school kicking and screaming.

I have worked in the engineering field for a quarter century and yes, the hours are flexible. There are two salaried types: exempt and non-exempt. Exempt means you are exampt from overtime pay and non-exempt means that you are paid overtime for work performed after 40 hours. I have been both.

The thing that is ignored is that salary exempt personnel also get a couple of perks. One is usually called "bonus weeks" or some such. This is an extra two weeks paid vacation time. It is to make up for some of the unpaid overtime worked through the year. They also get stock options as well. They get to come in when they get there and they leave when they are good and ready. If they work 38 hours they get paid for 40. If they work 42 hours they get paid for 40.

As far as ever needing someone to do things there will always be those with the volunteer spirit who get off on volunteerism. They enjoy it. It makes them feel better; and whether they are buying their way into Heaven, or simply doing what they feel is right, does not matter. They will always be there.

Without volunteers we would have no military. 'nuf said.
 
jimpeel said:
You said:

As for being "forced" to learn, any student can simply drop out of high school at any time they wish. No one will be dragging them back to school kicking and screaming.
Click to expand...

Then the mandatory community service would fall under the same umbrella, which is really what I was getting at..."forced" community service is no different than "forced" learning. It's only "forced" if the student chooses to be in school. If they choose not to obtain a diploma, the same way someone dropping out of school does, then they don't need to perform the community service.

jimpeel said:
UI have worked in the engineering field for a quarter century and yes, the hours are flexible. There are two salaried types: exempt and non-exempt. Exempt means you are exampt from overtime pay and non-exempt means that you are pauid overtime for work performed after 40 hours. I have been both.

The thing that is ignored is that salary exempt personnel also get a couple of perks. One is usually called "bonus weeks" or some such. This is an extra two weeks paid vacation time. It is to make up for some of the unpaid overtime worked through the year. They also get stock options as well. They get to come in when they get there and they leave when they are good and ready. If they work 38 hours they get paid for 40. If they work 42 hours they get paid for 40.
Click to expand...

I am what you would call exempt, and I do not get extra paid vacation. I do get profit sharing, based on performance, and will eventually be offered shares in the company. That said, those are not direction compensation for working 60 hours in a week, or coming in on a Saturday. Those things do of course get noticed, and factored into my profit sharing distribution but it's an indirect reimbursement and if the economy ended up busting and the company lost money that year (has never happened in the 50 years my company has been around) then there would be no profit to distribute...which brings me back to my point...he needs to lose the "I give you X hours, you give me X*hourly rate dollars" additude if he wants to make it in the industry.


jimpeel said:
As far as ever needing someone to do things there will always be those with the volunteer spirit who get off on volunteerism. They enjoy it. It makes them feel better; and whether they are buying their way into Heaven, or simply doing what they feel is right, does not matter. They will always be there.

Without volunteers we would have no military. 'nuf said.
Click to expand...

I wasn't talking about large scale volunteers...I was talking about needing someone to drive you to the airport, or feed your fish when you're out of town. If you don't do those types of things for your friends, eventually they're not gonna do them for you anymore...no matter how charitable they are...even those people will eventually feel used if you don't give anything back.
 
2minkey said:
you're REALLY starting to resemble our dearly departed markjs more and more everyday.

oh jimmy... your literal correctionist kung fu is so charming... why deny it?
Click to expand...


Yeah, its pretty sad when you have to correct those who make a living at it, huh. Sorry if it disappoints anyone that English is my first language.
 
Choosing to get an education should not mean being forced to work for free. Hell, I'd be all for forced servitude at the school. Let 'em earn part of their education. Being told that Millies Old Folks Home & Crematorium needs someone to empty bedpans & you can go put in the hours there or not graduate (4.0 or not) is horseshit.
 
Gonz said:
Choosing to get an education should not mean being forced to work for free. Hell, I'd be all for forced servitude at the school. Let 'em earn part of their education. Being told that Millies Old Folks Home & Crematorium needs someone to empty bedpans & you can go put in the hours there or not graduate (4.0 or not) is horseshit.
Click to expand...

I don't see anywhere that it says they have to put in the hours at a place of the school's or community's choosing. As I said, there are lots of things that qualify as community service...and most people with half a heart can find something that they care about to put in their hours...I see things I'd like to help out with (without monetary compensation) but have never got around to doing it...because I procrastinate. I think very few people wouldn't beable to find ANYTHING that they feel is worthy of their time, and those people are the ones who need the "encouragement" the most.
 
Nixy said:
I don't see anywhere that it says they have to put in the hours at a place of the school's or community's choosing. As I said, there are lots of things that qualify as community service...and most people with half a heart can find something that they care about to put in their hours...I see things I'd like to help out with (without monetary compensation) but have never got around to doing it...because I procrastinate. I think very few people wouldn't beable to find ANYTHING that they feel is worthy of their time, and those people are the ones who need the "encouragement" the most.
Click to expand...


So let's get a bit conspiratorial, shall we?

What if, and this is just a "what if", the goal of mandatory volunteerism is to condition those who are going to be entering the workforce to working for free? It is stated that in the future, and not that far distant of a future, the amount of taxes which will be required from workers will exceed 80% of their income. One cannot but define working for <20% of your wages as working for free during the other 80%. Kinda gives a whole new meaning to that part of "Ask what you can do for your country" that Kennedy espoused.

So what if this is the goal; to make people conditioned to working for the government for free? After all, isn't that one's duty; just as it is their "duty" to work for a diploma for free?
 
jimpeel said:
So let's get a bit conspiratorial, shall we?

What if, and this is just a "what if", the goal of mandatory volunteerism is to condition those who are going to be entering the workforce to working for free? It is stated that in the future, and not that far distant of a future, the amount of taxes which will be required from workers will exceed 80% of their income. One cannot but define working for <20% of your wages as working for free during the other 80%. Kinda gives a whole new meaning to that part of "Ask what you can do for your country" that Kennedy espoused.

So what if this is the goal; to make people conditioned to working for the government for free? After all, isn't that one's duty; just as it is their "duty" to work for a diploma for free?
Click to expand...

I'm Canadian, I don't think like that.
 
Nixy said:
I'm Canadian, I don't think like that.
Click to expand...

I didn't ask you to think like that. What I asked was a knowledgeable, educated opinion on what was hoisted which was admitted from the outset as a "what if".

So you have no opinion simply because you are a Canadian?
 
jimpeel said:
I didn't ask you to think like that. What I asked was a knowledgeable, educated opinion on what was hoisted which was admitted from the outset as a "what if".

So you have no opinion simply because you are a Canadian?
Click to expand...

If that is the government's intention then I think that whether or not kids have to volunteer for 100 hours to graduate highschool is the least of your worries.
 
jimpeel said:
As for being "forced" to learn, any student can simply drop out of high school at any time they wish. No one will be dragging them back to school kicking and screaming.
Click to expand...

Not here, pal. Drop out too young and your folks are charged with a crime.

And for someone who "goes that extra mile" to try and bring "happiness and joy" to all his baaaaaaa-ing customers, you sure have one helluva hypocritical streak in you. Maybe you'd be more in favor of this idea if you got credit for hugging people.
 
Gonz said:
Choosing to get an education should not mean being forced to work for free. Hell, I'd be all for forced servitude at the school. Let 'em earn part of their education. Being told that Millies Old Folks Home & Crematorium needs someone to empty bedpans & you can go put in the hours there or not graduate (4.0 or not) is horseshit.
Click to expand...

Yeah, just put em to work on the WPA pouring concrete thin as pancake batter to build bridges. That'll larn em.
 
paul_valaru said:
some causes are lost before they begin.
Click to expand...


senator-clinton.jpg




:evilcool:
 
SouthernN'Proud said:
Not here, pal. Drop out too young and your folks are charged with a crime.

And for someone who "goes that extra mile" to try and bring "happiness and joy" to all his baaaaaaa-ing customers, you sure have one helluva hypocritical streak in you. Maybe you'd be more in favor of this idea if you got credit for hugging people.
Click to expand...

First of all the requirement that public service be done as a requisite for a diploma usually happens at the twelfth grade level. They are old enough by then to make up their mind whether they want to drop out so no one is going to get dragged back.

As to the rest of that drivel, where have I said that I volunteer to work at Wal-Mart? I GET PAID FOR WHAT I DO. I give 100% of a day's work for 100% of a day's pay. There is no hypocrisy.

I guess you don't give a day's work for a day's pay huh? Well, that doesn't make you a hypocrite. It just makes you lazy.
 
SouthernN'Proud said:
Not here, pal. Drop out too young and your folks are charged with a crime.

And for someone who "goes that extra mile" to try and bring "happiness and joy" to all his baaaaaaa-ing customers, you sure have one helluva hypocritical streak in you. Maybe you'd be more in favor of this idea if you got credit for hugging people.
Click to expand...

:D
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top