London shaken by explosions

MrBishop said:
We don't have to wait that long... it's already happening and you're letting it happen...embracing it with open arms. "C'mon...take my freedoms away...I don't mind. Makes me feel safer"
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I'm not a terrorist so I don't have any objections. My liberties are the same today as they were on 9/10.

A person has no rights or an expectation to privacy on public property and must submit to scrutiny for public safety. I don't object to searches; I have nothing to hide.

The government must still show probable cause and get a court ordered warrant to do any searches of homes, phones, computers, bank accounts, etc.

.... eventually those rights that you're willing to give up for others today, will be your own rights that you're giving up tomorrow. you OK with search and seisure in your home town, with YOUR kids and wife? Security cameras looking over YOUR shoulder, YOUR purchases being traced, YOUR movements being traced?
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Life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness are an interwoven principle of freedom.

How can you have freedom without life? How can you pursue happiness when there are murderous religious fanatics in our midst?

And how does the "threat" of civil liberties being compromised compare to the threat of Islamic terrorism?

Do you embrace this guy's right to say what he has in your country:

Imam warns Ottawa to back off Muslims
Monday, July 25, 2005 Updated at 9:19 PM EDT
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/LAC.20050725.THREATS25/BNPrint/theglobeandmail/Canada


A controversial Toronto imam warned Public Safety Minister Anne McLellan at a closed-door meeting to stop "terrorizing" Canadian Muslims.

"If you try to cross the line I can't guarantee what is going to happen. Our young people, we can't control," Aly Hindy, the head of Scarborough's Salaheddin Islamic Centre, recalls telling the minister at the May meeting she held in Toronto with dozens of Muslim leaders.
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Winky said:
flamethrower.jpg
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"Boss, Boss---Da flames! Da flames!"



:beavbang:

Fire is cool
 
The Other One said:
Do you embrace this guy's right to say what he has in your country:
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To paraphrase many...I may not like what he is saying but I will fight to the end to protect his freedom to say it.

In addition
The imam said six or seven young men have approached him to discuss "fighting overseas" in place such as Iraq and Afghanistan.

He said he told them "people fighting in Iraq, they don't need more people."

Instead, Canadian Muslims can wage non-violent jihads (holy struggles) at home. "You have a very good chance to serve Islam here," he said he told them."


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MrBishop said:
To paraphrase many...I may not like what he is saying but I will fight to the end to protect his freedom to say it.
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At what point does his right to free speech supercede your rights to live peacefully?
 
The Other One said:
I'm not a terrorist so I don't have any objections. My liberties are the same today as they were on 9/10.

A person has no rights or an expectation to privacy on public property and must submit to scrutiny for public safety. I don't object to searches; I have nothing to hide.

The government must still show probable cause and get a court ordered warrant to do any searches of homes, phones, computers, bank accounts, etc.
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Best re-read HR3162 Patriot Act plus a few of the recent changes like
"but also expand the government's investigative powers to permit the FBI to demand health, library, and tax records in intelligence investigations without judicial approval."

Read about ECPA - Governs government access to stored email and other electronic communications. Within ECPA, the Pen Register statute governs real time interception of "numbers dialed or otherwise transmitted on the telephone line to which such device is attached." Although the use of such devices requires a court order, it does not require probable cause: there is no judicial discretion, and the court must authorize the surveillance upon government certification. A government attorney need only certify to the court that the "information likely to be obtained by such installation and use is relevant to an ongoing criminal investigation."

The use of Carnivore

The expansion of the 'pen register' thusly: By expanding the nature of the information that can be captured, the new law clearly expanded pen register capacities to the Internet, covering electronic mail, Web surfing, and all other forms of electronic communications.

etc etc...

The Patriot Act and its progeny have changed quite a few things since 9/10.
 
MrBishop said:
Best re-read HR3162 Patriot Act plus a few of the recent changes like
"but also expand the government's investigative powers to permit the FBI to demand health, library, and tax records in intelligence investigations without judicial approval."

Read about ECPA - Governs government access to stored email and other electronic communications. Within ECPA, the Pen Register statute governs real time interception of "numbers dialed or otherwise transmitted on the telephone line to which such device is attached." Although the use of such devices requires a court order, it does not require probable cause: there is no judicial discretion, and the court must authorize the surveillance upon government certification. A government attorney need only certify to the court that the "information likely to be obtained by such installation and use is relevant to an ongoing criminal investigation."

The use of Carnivore

The expansion of the 'pen register' thusly: By expanding the nature of the information that can be captured, the new law clearly expanded pen register capacities to the Internet, covering electronic mail, Web surfing, and all other forms of electronic communications.

etc etc...

The Patriot Act and its progeny have changed quite a few things since 9/10.
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Translation:


Fri Jul 22, 6:57 AM ET

The roving wiretap provision, Section 206, allows investigators to obtain warrants to intercept a suspect's phone conversations or Internet traffic without limiting it to a specific phone or identifying the suspect. The records provision, Section 215, authorizes federal officials to obtain "tangible items" such as business, library and medical records.

Advocates argued that such powers already exist in criminal investigations so they should be expressly continued for terrorism investigations. They also cited safeguards in the bill, such as a requirement that a judge approve the records search.

Hours earlier, the Senate Judiciary Committee approved its own general extension of the law, but it called for Congress to re-examine the wiretap and library provisions after another four-year time period. The full Senate likely will vote on the bill this fall, before the competing measures are reconciled in a conference committee.
http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20050722/ap_on_go_co/patriot_act
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Gonz said:
The term war has many meanings. Since 1945 we've been at armed conflict for about 15 years
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Armed conflict is a term that could be applied to the inner cities!

No my friend thar's no war
we won WWIII with the fall of Soviet Roosha in 89. (without ever firein’ a Nook)

The 'conflict' with the moosies certainly has no chance in Heck of ever causing the devastation an all out Soviet nuclear first strike would have wrought.

Pearl Harbor's casualties were similar to 9-11.
What followed was horrific by any standard of measure for U.S. as well as the rest of the world.

The nuclear bomb has so far given U.S. the longest unabated period of peace we've ever known.
(yea nukes)

Certainly no one in their right mind believes that the western werld
will go down in defeat to the Islameo-fascists?

Yep we've aboot as much to fear from the towelies
as we do from the Chinese :winkkiss:

Now back to the "Spice channel”…

Or if you insist on getting’ yer panties inna bunch
head on over to Michael Savage’s site
and watch some good old fashioned (Islam is the religion of peace) beheadings!
 
:jump:


SAVAGE: I'd like to see them [Muslim extremists] hanging from lampposts in the entire Middle East. I'd like to see the Muslim world rise up en masse. ... [T]hen I as an American will believe -- and you know what I'll believe? I'll believe there's a difference between the two. Not until then. Otherwise, until I see that day, that they're strung up from lampposts, they're lying to me. And that they're really secretly getting off on these murderers, because they don't have the guts to do it themselves. Okay, that's when I'll believe in the heart of hearts -- when I see them hanging from lampposts, with their guts hanging out, then I'll believe that there's a difference between radical Islam and the rest of Islam over there. But if I don't see that -- if I don't see the massive uprising against them, I can only assume that they're the shock troops of all of Islam in the Middle East. How do you like that? That's my opinion. I'm not George Bush running for office, and this message was approved by Michael Savage.
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:bgpile:


Right now, even people sitting on the fence would like George Bush to drop a nuclear weapon on an Arab country. They don't even care which one it would be. I can guarantee you -- I don't need to go to Mr. Schmuck [pollster John] Zogby and ask him his opinion. I don't need anyone's opinion. I'll give you my opinion, because I got a better stethoscope than those fools. It's one man's opinion based upon my own analysis. The most -- I tell you right now -- the largest percentage of Americans would like to see a nuclear weapon dropped on a major Arab capital. They don't even care which one. They'd like an indiscriminate use of a nuclear weapon. They want this over with. One thing people cannot live with, which is an undefined, limitless conflict, which is what we have now. They can't take it. They want this war over with, and they want it ended like the war against Japan. They'd like Big Boy dropped on one of the little cities over there. They don't care where. They don't care any more. The American people have had it up to here with this garbage.

In fact, Christianity has been one of the great salvations on planet Earth. It's what's necessary in the Middle East. Others have written about it, I think these people need to be forcibly converted to Christianity but I'll get here a little later, I'll move up to that. It's the only thing that can probably turn them into human beings.

I'm going to give you one further example from my background as an anthropologist just so that you -- I'm trying to put context on this because you can go crazy if you don't have the context on this, because I'm going to lead up to something of what we must do to these primitives. Because these primitives can only be treated in one way, and I don't think smallpox and a blanket is good enough incidentally. Just before -- I'm going to give you a little precursor to where I'm going. Smallpox in a blanket, which the U.S. Army gave to the Cherokee Indians on their long march to the West, was nothing compared to what I'd like to see done to these people, just so you understand that I'm not going to be too intellectual about my analysis here in terms of what I would recommend, what Doc Savage recommends as an antidote to this kind of poison coming out of the Middle East from these non-humans.
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Not wanting to talk out of turn, the police think they have all of them.

I have read all the posts describing whether or not it was right to shoot the brazilian man. Regardless of rights or wrongs, this place is a war zone right now and in any war innocent people become collateral. Argue all you want from foreign shores but its kill or be killed. I know which side I take.
 
Next time you think your having a bad day, take a moment to think about this guy.

0,,217573,00.jpg


Failed suicide bomber and now the indignity of having to strip to your underwear on live TV.
 
Lopan said:
Not wanting to talk out of turn, the police think they have all of them.

I have read all the posts describing whether or not it was right to shoot the brazilian man. Regardless of rights or wrongs, this place is a war zone right now and in any war innocent people become collateral. Argue all you want from foreign shores but its kill or be killed. I know which side I take.
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Right on, brother.
 
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