Looks like people DO have issues with the confederate flag
- Thread starter paul_valaru
- Start date
Inkara1
Well-Known Member
Now that taking Native Americans out of collegiate logos is pretty well accomplished, I guess it's now on to the stars and bars battle flag... of course, betting, steroids, academic fraud, unscrupulous agents, etc. aren't being taken care of in an effective manner... but I can sure sleep better at night knowing that they're all over this flag thing.
paul_valaru
100% Pure Canadian Beef
well it was an issue for them, and they fixed it.
SouthernN'Proud
Southern Discomfort
paul_valaru said:
I initially thought that this post wasn't even worthy of a reply from me. Its intent is glaringly obvious.
But, seeing as I have never been one to run from a fight (I'll leave that to others...), and given that maybe sometime three years from now a new member might happen across this thread and maybe learn something from it besides the usual liberal chickenshit brainless asinine drivel that passes for thought for some folk, what the hey. Right?
Remember, y'all, I didn't start this one. Keep your whining to yourself, or direct it at the shit stirrers themselves.
So. Let's just analyze this little piece of vitriol together, shall we?
OK. Fine. That has as much chance of going anywhere as a snowball has surviving a furnace. But, boycott away, ye small minded uninformed hypocrites. People boycott things every day. I personally observe an economic boycott (meaning I won't purchase...I'll try to use small words) of WalMart, Coca-Cola, General Motors, the writings of Tom Clancy, and Disney. That's one of the nifty things about being an adult. You can make decisions. You have to live with the consequences of those decisions (ideally at least), but you get to make them.
No, not all. That's an excuse, a scapegoat if you will.
The flag. Let's discuss the flag for a moment.
1. I hereby offer an unopened box of 24 Moon Pies, shipped to the address of your choice, to the first person who can show me the Confederate flag. Offer void to SimplyRed, Slim Pickens, catocom, and Fluer Vanderloo as these people have educated themselves sufficiently to know one when they see it. There may be others, and there's always Google. I wager I could walk into a meeting of the NAACP with the Confederate flag and nobody would notice. I know for a fact that a ballcap with the Bonnie Blue was given to a black man by his wife because she thought it was a Dallas Cowboys hat.
2. Why would this flag be a problem? Judging from popular opinion, many people still operate under the incorrect notion that the flag depicted in my avatar stood for slavery. That flag represented an army. An army fighting off invasion from a foreigh territory which invaded it. It never flew for one second for another purpose, despite how ell that would have fit so many theories. The flag that flew over legal slavery the longest was the American flag. The flag that flew over slave markets was the American flag. The flag on the bow of every slave ship bound for this coast was the American flag. Why doesn't the NCAA boycott that one if they want to make their statement?
I think we all know why. If you as a reader of this post do not, PM me and I will be exalted to explain it to you.
3. The losing side of a war. Well, let me think. The American flag flew in support and defense of the South Vietnamese people for a lot longer than four years, and that war was won by the North Vietnamese, so lots of flags fly that lost wars. I wasn't aware that in and of itself was a crime. Last time I checked, the Union Jack flew proudly despite losing that little tiff in the 1770s. Nobody has their panties in a wad over that. Must just be something special about this flag, huh? I certainly think there is, and I'm glad so many of you seem to implicitly agree with me. It's the first step toward true understanding, so be proud of yourselves for supporting it. Though you are doing so unknowingly, but that's OK...it ain't the only thing you unknowingly support.
Lots of things are used by hate groups. The most commonly used symbol associated with hate groups is (drum roll) the American flag. So let's just start by boycotting it, because hate groups use it. Others would be British Knights sneakers (used by the Crips street gang, a hate group by any definition I would think), Notre Dame sports paraphernalia (used by white supremists), Ziploc storage bags (used by illegal drug sellers to package their products, the vast majority of which is trafficked by street gangs), Calvin Kline apparel (used by the Bloods street gang), McDonald's (even hate mongers gotta eat, right?), the Koran (fairly obvious I would think), and tofu (used by militant vegetarians and vegans universally, and they hate meat eaters).
Now. These hate groups. I have said on here until I am blue in the face (or should that be red in the neck?) that some groups have usurped the Confederate battle flag for use in their own nefarious plots. That is not the fault of the flag, those who support it, or those who fought under it. To suggest otherwise is childish, ignorant, and, well...hateful. If the skinheads started parading around the Maple Leaf flag as an icon of the ideal predominantly white society, would that make anyone boycott the Maple Leaf flag? Would it justify hatred of anyone who displayed it?
Oh, but THAT'S DIFFERENT, right?
Lastly, let's not leave out the title of this little bait...I mean thread.
I hate to have to be the one to break this to you, but lots of people have issues with lots of things. I know people who have issues with abortion. I know people who have issues with legalizing marijuana. I know people who have issues with public school policies regarding prayer. I know people who have issues with leaving your spouse to shack up with someone else. I know people who have issues with American armed forces being deployed in Iraq. The list is endless. Does that make every issue valid? Each person will have to answer that for him or herself. My brother-in-law the minister has an issue with the removal of the Ten Commandments from public places. Am I obligated to make that my issue?
Oprah Winfrey would be unemployed if there were no people with issues.
(Come to think of it, that ain't a bad idea really...)
So some people have issues with the public display of the Confederate battle flag. In other news, Inky's Generalisimo buddy is still dead, as are Andrea Yates' children while she cavorts around a plush mental hospital instead of being on death row. I have an issue with that.
I don't like the fact that in most major American cities, the Mexican flag may fly freely. That in New York City, a wide variety of national flags can fly freely depending on the holiday or even on who won a freakin soccer game. That when a Canadian sports team plays a game in America, we must sit through their national anthem even if not one player on the team is Canadian. Yet this one flag, which stood and stands for an army of defenders of home and hearth, is reviled on its own soil.
Not on my watch. And not to my face either. Try me sometime and see.
So toddle along now. You obviously wanted a reaction, and I have patronized you with one. Feel better? More manly? More important? Fulfilled?
Didn't think so. Hate that for you. Hey, go get some of that designer coffee, that should cheer you right up. And don't worry yourself too much over us poor backward inbred gun-totin' gap-toothed stupid rednecks. We been just fine without Canadian support groups for hundreds of years now. I figure we'll survive this too. And fear not. You may continue your attacks from the safety of your keyboard without fear of anybody down this way giving you a second thought. I need to get going now. Much to do, much to do. Got a life to live and all that. But if I may be of further assistance to you, please don't hesitate to let me know. It's always a pleasure.
Deo vindice.
Professur
Well-Known Member
*offers a beer to SnP. He needs the break*
I'd own those moonpies, but they'd never make it across the border. One of the many books the missus picked up during our last sojourn was Flags of the Confederacy. Can't remember if it was at Memorial hall at Stone mountain, or the museum at Kennesaw she got it from. But one of those two.
And .... I'd just like to note that I, personally, fly the Lion Rampant and the St-Andrew's cross daily, and not a word is said.
I'd own those moonpies, but they'd never make it across the border. One of the many books the missus picked up during our last sojourn was Flags of the Confederacy. Can't remember if it was at Memorial hall at Stone mountain, or the museum at Kennesaw she got it from. But one of those two.
And .... I'd just like to note that I, personally, fly the Lion Rampant and the St-Andrew's cross daily, and not a word is said.
SouthernN'Proud
Southern Discomfort
Gonz said:
No, a flag representing an army on the battlefield. Nothing more, nothing less. That army could have been left dormant if the simpletons in Washington had not been so zealous to have their government paid for by the sweat off Southern brows. And if you don't believe that, I'll quote your hero for you.
Wrong again. Thanks for playing, Johnny tell him what he's won.
Why does that apply only to a battle flag? One that never represented one notion either way about slavery? Because it fits your myth? Irrelevent. I know how hard it is for yankees to hear that their opinion isn't the driving force behind anything, but swallow it and get over it. Historically documented fact is not on your side here. Then, when did that ever stop any of you?
You do, however, win the Moon Pies. PM me an address and they will be shipped forthwith. Unlike some elected heads of State, my word is good.
SouthernN'Proud
Southern Discomfort
Inkara1 said:I do believe this is what he was looking for:
Both are correct. Inky's is the more recognizable, but both were official Confederate National Flags.
SouthernN'Proud said:
Let me reword it for you
A flag representng a group wishing to create rebellion against the United States.
Since we don't want our flag desecrated because of what (or whom) it represents, that flag would fall under the same category. It represented a group who wished to divide a nation, read:rebellion. Since rebellion is one of the Constitutional crimes, Lincoln had no choice, since his oath is to Defend the Constitution of the United States. The confederates wished to make two lesser countries.
SouthernN'Proud
Southern Discomfort
Gonz said:
Again, you are dead wrong.
No one wanted rebellion except the northern industrialists. The Southern people wanted to go their own way in peace. That is why Mississippi gave away its timber crop to the US government - to make a clean break. They still haven't recovered from that economically.
Divide a nation? In one sense, maybe. The desired outcome was a clean break from a voluntary union. I guess you can join, but you can't leave. Didn't The Eagles write a song with that idea in it?
Lincoln had choices all right. Take the ballyhooed Emancipation Proclamation. In that little doozy, he chose to free the slaves of a foreign country, but to keep the slaves in the United States as slaves. Obviously, he wasn't too good at this choice thing...
The Confederates did not wish to make two lesser nations. They wished to make their OWN nation. We didn't really care too much what happened to the rest of y'all. Kinda like sauce for the gander. We got tired of always getting the shit end of the stick.
And either would have been lesser...IN YOUR OPINION. See my above post for how much that's worth.
SnP said:
OK mr 1860s professur sir....how many slaves were there in Union States at this time?
He didn't need to specifically free union slaves, if there were any....the US ratified the 13th in 1865. That did what the Supreme Court couldn't overrule (see Dredd Scott decision)
woodman19_99
New Member
I've never done this in a class before, but...
I am interested in both sides of this one. I know what I was taught, but since SnP feels so strongly on this one, I guess I need to try and see his side as well...
I am interested in both sides of this one. I know what I was taught, but since SnP feels so strongly on this one, I guess I need to try and see his side as well...
SouthernN'Proud
Southern Discomfort
Gonz said:
Wrong again. It was ratified in 1868, three full years after Appomattox. It took the holy union states three years to pass it, and that was with them barring Southern legislators from voting on it.
Do try and read a little sometime.
And we both know damn well there were union slaves until the end of the war. Grant himself had slaves, and when asked why he didn't free them his reply was, "Good help is so hard to find."
Try your lines elsewhere, man. Some of us know better.