Saturdays Vote

BeardofPants said:
As per usual, you are reduced to flame-baiting when you have nothing conducive to say to the debate. :swing: At any rate, if the people who are actively complaining about that mess in Iraq are 'morons', then what does that say about the person who exacerbated the problem to begin with? :la:

*mirrors AB
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Like I said. Complaining is easy. Finding the solution is hard. If all you're doing is complaining, you're doing nothing to solve the problem. If you refuse, after being asked, to provide a solution, instead of just complaining, then you had no idea what you were doing to begin with, so, ipso-facto, you are a moron.
 
Gato_Solo said:
Like I said. Complaining is easy. Finding the solution is hard. If all you're doing is complaining, you're doing nothing to solve the problem. If you refuse, after being asked, to provide a solution, instead of just complaining, then you had no idea what you were doing to begin with, so, ipso-facto, you are a moron.
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You're being a moron by sticking to this dumb premise. As I said before most of the threads here wouldn't be valid by your ridiculous standard. Also as I said, being aware of the problem is half the battle many times.

In this case simply knowing that the results may have been rigged allows us to look at those results in a different light than if we didn't have that information.
 
flavio said:
You're being a moron by sticking to this dumb premise. As I said before most of the threads here wouldn't be valid by your ridiculous standard. Also as I said, being aware of the problem is half the battle many times.
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At least when I reply to your posts, I do so with some kind of a solution... with a solution you may not like...but not just a bunch of endless complaints about a broken system...


flavio said:
In this case simply knowing that the results may have been rigged allows us to look at those results in a different light than if we didn't have that information.
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But what do you propose to fix the problem? There has never been a vote anywhere that is 100% perfect, so how would you fix the problem? You can point at a pile of crap, and walk by...you can point at a pile of crap, and complain about it...or you can pick up the pile of crap, and dispose of it properly...what does your 'pointing out the problem' most equate with?
 
My idea for Iraq is to allow them to vote for themselves though to try to prevent the Sunnis from interfering; they are the ones using violence to stop the voting.


As per natural disasters: They are and will always be a problem. One would have thought that we had tried to be prepared but we were not. More evacuation procedures, more time to allow for others to know before it is too late, and for more roads or some sort of means out.


I admit those are rather shitty but they are something to play with or think about while a more plausible solution can be formulated
 
Gato_Solo said:
But what do you propose to fix the problem?
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Look, you're premise is ridiculous. You've been told that by several people now as well as me but you still keep asking me for a solution. I'm not playing this stupid game if you have nothing else to say than "what's your solution" when someone posts news you don't want to hear.
 
flavio said:
Look, you're premise is ridiculous. You've been told that by several people now as well as me but you still keep asking me for a solution. I'm not playing this stupid game if you have nothing else to say than "what's your solution" when someone posts news you don't want to hear.
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Nope. You're just here to complain about the work somebody else is doing, just to prop up your fragile idea of how things should work. The very fact that you do not even try to solve the problem means that you don't care. You bitch about the status quo, but when you have an opportunity to share your plan to fix the problem, you get indignant. When I show everyone what you are, you get upset, and people start putting me on ignore. Doesn't really matter. Most of them have no plan, either, so all they are doing is burying their heads in the sand...as usual.

It's far easier to bitch, whine, moan, and complain than it is to do something to make a change.
 
Gato_Solo said:
Nope. You're just here to complain about the work somebody else is doing, just to prop up your fragile idea of how things should work. The very fact that you do not even try to solve the problem means that you don't care. You bitch about the status quo, but when you have an opportunity to share your plan to fix the problem, you get indignant. When I show everyone what you are, you get upset, and people start putting me on ignore. Doesn't really matter. Most of them have no plan, either, so all they are doing is burying their heads in the sand...as usual.

It's far easier to bitch, whine, moan, and complain than it is to do something to make a change.
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:worship:
 
Solution - don't make it a constitution to be voted on by laymen. That way, you don't ahve to worry about votes being tallied, cheating, bombs at polling stations etc.

This has to be one of the first in history where a constitution was actually approved by the people it means to rule over BEFORE it's even in place and working.

What the people are voting on is the wording and intent, but not the reality of how it will play IRL. For all we or anyone knows, this voted on and accepted constituition is completely unworkable and won't survive it's first judicial tests by application. Then what? It gets changed and the people go back to vote?

:shrug:
 
You just siad what not to do, and offered no advice on what TO do. That's the same as pointing at a problem and offering no solution.
 
HomeLAN said:
You just siad what not to do, and offered no advice on what TO do. That's the same as pointing at a problem and offering no solution.
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The advice I gave was to write the constitution, vote for it internally and pass it without involving the people in any vote. Start applying it and modify it as needed.

It's moot now though. The constitution was voted on and passed. They have to worry about making sure tht the count was accurate, or rather, accurate enough to still be considered passed.
 
MrBishop said:
Solution - don't make it a constitution to be voted on by laymen. That way, you don't ahve to worry about votes being tallied, cheating, bombs at polling stations etc.

This has to be one of the first in history where a constitution was actually approved by the people it means to rule over BEFORE it's even in place and working.

What the people are voting on is the wording and intent, but not the reality of how it will play IRL. For all we or anyone knows, this voted on and accepted constituition is completely unworkable and won't survive it's first judicial tests by application. Then what? It gets changed and the people go back to vote?

:shrug:
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I am a bit confused here Marc. By not letting the laymen(people) vote wouldnt that be impeding on their rights which is the antithesis of what a democracy is (though America itself isnt fully a democracy, it is a Constitutional Republic) and therefore not what the government here wants(or at least is stating) I do agree with the idea of letting the people approve it before it is executed.
 
Gato_Solo said:
Nope. You're just here to complain about the work somebody else is doing, just to prop up your fragile idea of how things should work. The very fact that you do not even try to solve the problem means that you don't care. You bitch about the status quo, but when you have an opportunity to share your plan to fix the problem, you get indignant. When I show everyone what you are, you get upset, and people start putting me on ignore. Doesn't really matter. Most of them have no plan, either, so all they are doing is burying their heads in the sand...as usual.

It's far easier to bitch, whine, moan, and complain than it is to do something to make a change.
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The fact you keep sticking to this ridiculous premise means that you don't care if the vote was rigged. It's easier for you to whine, moan, and bitch about me not providing a solution than to actually discuss the issue. You're just burying your head in the sand trying to ignore it.
 
Iraq's electoral commission said 79% of voters backed the constitution against 21% who were opposed.

79% is hard to fix. Now, let the people take their country & do as they see fit.

Guardian
 
Can't find your glasses today Gonz? This is from your same source....

[font=Geneva,Arial,sans-serif]"I have just prayed to God that he will expose the truth about what is happening in Iraq. We all know that this referendum was fraud conducted by an electoral commission that is not independent,"[/font]
 
So? Why is 79% less hard to fix than, say, 56%?

Or 92%?

How about you write down the figures between 0-100 and rank them on a scale of difficulty to achieve in a fixed referendum?
 
By the way, I think Saddam Hussein used to be quite regularly elected to power with percentage votes ranging in the 90s. Probably even 100% which would probably be incredibly difficult to fix.
 
Bobby Hogg said:
By the way, I think Saddam Hussein used to be quite regularly elected to power with percentage votes ranging in the 90s. Probably even 100% which would probably be incredibly difficult to fix.
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*edit - I need to read more than the last 2 posts before replying. Dumbass = me rightnow.
 
Holy crap this thread sucks.

Now stop callin' each other morons before I have to start smacking down.
 
Gonz said:
Iraq's electoral commission said 79% of voters backed the constitution against 21% who were opposed.

79% is hard to fix. Now, let the people take their country & do as they see fit.

Guardian
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Stats can be manipulated to fit what a person wants. Especially in the media.


Saddam probably got such high ratings because he rigged elections.
 
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