When offended parties clash

Leslie said:
feeding my kids something I don't want them fed is a mite different than teaching them about an idea I don't agree with/don't want them taught.
Click to expand...

Abso-fucking-lutely not. Feeding...the ingestion of X. Food, and ideals, are being fed here. More social awareness programs that have no business in our schools. Bigotry, on either side, has no place being taught in our schools & is another in a long line of why we home school.

Reading, wRiting & aRithmetic is for school. Morality, in any sense, is for home & church.
 
So it'd be ok with you then if the teacher gave each kid a bowl of candy every day to bribe them to behave?
 
Leslie said:
So it'd be ok with you then if the teacher gave each kid a bowl of candy every day to bribe them to behave?
Click to expand...

I'm not going to answer this because I don't really think it's directed at me, but I'll say this much...

Nobody has a right to teach morality decisions to your children except you. You, the parent(s), is going to be there when your child skins his/her knee, is sick with a cold/the flu, makes friends, makes enemies, falls in love, etc...and not the state. If you give the state the right to tell your child what to think, and how to think, then why have you around at all? Extreme, yes, but that's the path you are heading down. ;)
 
Leslie said:
So it'd be ok with you then if the teacher gave each kid a bowl of candy every day to bribe them to behave?
Click to expand...

I don't understand your reasoning so the question makes no sense to me. On the surface, no. I don't want my kid fed candy anymore than I want him fed moral values I may disagree with.
 
Are you afraid that what you teach them at home isn't sufficient to counter what they may be 'fed' elsewhere? I teach them my right and wrong. After that, they're free to make their own choices. To insulate them or disallow them from access to other thoughts, information and opinions is immoral in itself.
 
Leslie said:
Are you afraid that what you teach them at home isn't sufficient to counter what they may be 'fed' elsewhere? I teach them my right and wrong. After that, they're free to make their own choices. To insulate them or disallow them from access to other thoughts, information and opinions is immoral in itself.
Click to expand...

The matter is not disallowing them from access, information, and opinions. It's having that access, information, and opinion taught to them in school. Big difference between discovering something that may be disagreeable, and being led there.
 
Leslie said:
Are you afraid that what you teach them at home isn't sufficient to counter what they may be 'fed' elsewhere? I teach them my right and wrong. After that, they're free to make their own choices. To insulate them or disallow them from access to other thoughts, information and opinions is immoral in itself.
Click to expand...

OK, I just have to ask this.

I get the gist of what you are saying and in many aspects cannot disagree with it. But let's just say your kids start smoking dope. I've done it before, but I stopped many many years ago. Now, as part of my job, I find myself putting folks back in jail for doing it. It's fair to say that I do not approve of it, period. If my step-daughter decided to do this, I would be livid; her mother would take more of a "At least she's doing it at home where we can monitor her" stance. I dread the teenage years to say the least.

For the sake of argument though, let's say you held my own opinion of it - it's wrong, it's illegal, and I don't approve of my kids doing it and will do anything in my power to keep them from doing it. And then one of your kids gets caught with some pot. What then?

Honestly, I have no ulterior motive in asking this...I'm simply curious.
 
I do hold your own opinion of it. Plus, it makes you permanently stupid. Their father case in point. And I tell them that (not the father bit). I can disallow it in my home, consequence any evidence of it, and continue open discussion, blahblahblah. But after that it's up to them, innit?

Insulate them or not, eventually they're gonna be out there in it, they may as well be well-informed and have good free thinking skills instilled first.
 
Leslie said:
After that, they're free to make their own choices.
Click to expand...


They're CHILDREN. Are they free to choose brocolli or Oreos? Are they free to choose stayng up late or bedtime? Ice cream instead of medicine?

Yes, they will hear other idea's out there. They will not be TAUGHT those idea's though.
 
SouthernN'Proud said:
For the sake of argument though, let's say you held my own opinion of it - it's wrong, it's illegal, and I don't approve of my kids doing it and will do anything in my power to keep them from doing it. And then one of your kids gets caught with some pot. What then?
Click to expand...


I'll answer this one just for fun...

The difference between a teacher & a hypocrite;

A hypocrite says do as I say, not as I do.
A teacher learns from their past & changes it to do as I say, not as I did.
 
Free to make their own choices about the person they wish to be and the ideals they wish to adopt.

Health/lifestyle matters, not quite yet. It's coming though. I've never yet had to argue about medicine or veggies :shrug:
 
Leslie said:
I do hold your own opinion of it. Plus, it makes you permanently stupid. Their father case in point. And I tell them that (not the father bit). I can disallow it in my home, consequence any evidence of it, and continue open discussion, blahblahblah. But after that it's up to them, innit?

Insulate them or not, eventually they're gonna be out there in it, they may as well be well-informed and have good free thinking skills instilled first.
Click to expand...


Again, no argument from me that they will indeed be exposed to it. My point is, I do not consider this kid capable of "making these decisions" on her own - translation: doing as she damn well pleases - until she hits 18. At which point, she is an adult in the eyes of the law and may indeed do as she damn well pleases. I may and likely will be disappointed in some of her choices, but I do not have to endorse them. I will not endorse her going directly against what her mother and I instruct until she turns 18. Then, if it becomes too large an issue, she may spread them wings and go do as she chooses.

Long and short of it, as long as she is a juvenile, our choices are in force. If she goes against them in meaningful ways, she pays the price. After that magical age, she plays by different rules. We may no longer maintain such strict control over her behaviors. She may, at that time, choose to fly the coop if she doesn't like the way the rooster and hen run it. And yes, I know that 18 is simply a number. But that's the number the law chooses to recognize.

*surfing with the thread drift...gee, this is fun!*
 
Ideal they wish to adopt? OK, lil Billy decides he wants to be a nazi. Do you allow it?
 
You know Gonz, if you have instilled what you want to instill, and have also ensured that they are free thinkers with logic, it follows that whenever they hear whatever they hear, they'll consider and reject what they think is not right just as you do.

I like it when my kids come home and say, the teacher said "blank" and that's crap. I like that they are allowed to say that to the teacher and question what they're told, and allowed to present their cases.

Don't your kids have the right to decide for themselves whether they think "not that there's anything wrong with that"?
 
Gonz said:
Ideal they wish to adopt? OK, lil Billy decides he wants to be a nazi. Do you allow it?
Click to expand...
Does that therefore mean we should never teach children about nazis?

I can teach them what I know. I can instill the values I think they need. After that, it's really and truly up to them.
 
Leslie said:
Don't your kids have the right to decide for themselves whether they think "not that there's anything wrong with that"?
Click to expand...

He is entitled to think anything he choses. If I decide it's wrong, I'll make damned sure he knows it & why. I am the parent & I will teach my child right from wrong. He is a child. He doesn't have the authority nor the ability to fully digest choices available. Let 'em decide. Then show them the error, or how wise their choice is & why.
 
Right. Exactly. So how is this situation harmful? He'll hear something. He, with you guiding him, will make the decision about what he thinks about it.

Just afraid of the information?
 
I'm afraid of the information that I don't know about nor expect. Thus I am unable to counter. I doubt they sent home a flyer saying

HEY PARENTS,
Next week is homosexuals are good week. We'll be showing films & having the Village People in for a discussion.
Click to expand...

and even if they did, s what. It is not the place of the public ecucation system to indoctrinate my kid. It is their job to educate.
 
''I don't think there's any harm done to parents who find their children exposed to ideas that are different than the ones they teach at home,'' Education Minister Gerard Kennedy said.

That is the only way that ony child will be allowed to make any informed decision on any matter...Show them all sides of the issue and hope that they've got enough of a brain to decide which is the better of the two or three or 17 sides. :)

I find this argument similar to that of parents who want to remove sex-ed from schools entirely, because they think that talking about it makes the kids suddenly get all libidinous and start fucking everyone in sight.

Knowledge is and always shall be stronger than ignorance. The parents want to keep their kids ignorant that there is another side to the issue of homosexuality than they have, and got from their parents and their grandparents etc... that's wrong.

Its just as wrong as a Born again Christian refusing to have their child taught anything that goes against Creationism...including physics (because it talks about the earth not being flat and it being older than 7000 years old), or chemistry (which might show their kids that apes and man have similar bloodtypes) etc...
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top