Don't like our policies

[Ardsgaine]

My problem with the far left and the far right in America, is that the vast majority is neither one, and yet both presume to tell the rest of us what to do for our own good. When someone presumes to tell me what's good for me, I get really defensive and start looking for his or her ulterior motive. Here's an idea, why don't we let the majority run the country?

I guess I wasn't clear either. I consider the Democrat and Republican parties to be generally middle of the road on the political spectrum, with the Democrats somewhat left of the Republicans. Both have positions that violate individual rights, but generally the Democrats violate economic rights, while the Republicans violate social rights. That's not 100%, of course, because there's overlap, and they help each other out on occasion.

When someone presumes to tell me what's good for me, I get really defensive and start looking for his or her ulterior motive.

Likewise.

Here's an idea, why don't we let the majority run the country?

They are. There's just a lot of confusion out there about how to protect individual rights, and they don't have a party that consistently defends them.

PS, gotta go beat some more infidel grass into abject submission, back later.

Slay the infidels! May John Deere (peace be upon him), guide you always.

 

[Squiggy]

Well if he is as far right as you can get, why the fuck even mention that ANYTHING else is left? Shouldn't it all just be assumed. The original idea in which he hanged this lable on the left was more dem v rep. Now you want to cloud it all with ecopolitical psychobabble...

Oddly enough. Its always been the rabid right that posts all of the flamebating threads in this forum. Then they throw that lable at the left for responding. Well fuck each and everyone of you respectively. I tried but I ain't putting up with the BS anymore....Go kill whoever the fuck you want. Let peple carry AK47s in our streets then cry for more law enforcement when one of them gets used. Keep ignoring all the corporate welfare so and just complain about the social programs. Ther is no balance to be had. not in this forum....

 

[Ardsgaine]

There's plenty of room on the spectrum to be "left of Ards" and still be "right in general."

Exactly.

And remember, I don't see the labels of right and left as really working so well, since I see three extremes and only two labels. But again that's the result of mixing up the social and economic categorizations.

I think that the social and economic categories are inextricably bound together. If fascism and communism differ on exactly how they are going to appropriate private property and violate individual rights, that's just a superficial difference.

 

[Q]

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[Ardsgaine]

Well if he is as far right as you can get, why the fuck even mention that ANYTHING else is left? Shouldn't it all just be assumed. The original idea in which he hanged this lable on the left was more dem v rep. Now you want to cloud it all with ecopolitical psychobabble...

Oddly enough. Its always been the rabid right that posts all of the flamebating threads in this forum. Then they throw that lable at the left for responding. Well fuck each and everyone of you respectively. I tried but I ain't putting up with the BS anymore....Go kill whoever the fuck you want. Let peple carry AK47s in our streets then cry for more law enforcement when one of them gets used. Keep ignoring all the corporate welfare so and just complain about the social programs. Ther is no balance to be had. not in this forum....

Squiggy, you are so full of shit, it's not funny. I have not flamed you once. I have been extremely patient under your barrage of insults, caricaturizations and polemics. You have yet to address any of the arguments I've made-- at least, not in this thread, and I've been to busy to get over to the others. You're still on your feet, you're still talking trash, but you've got no arguments left in you. I'm going to have to call this a TKO, and end it.

Oh, yeah... fuck you too.

 

[Leslie]

Squiggy....

 

[Squiggy]

Sorry Ards....I would say throwing a Nazi lable up for me to catch is pretty fucking flaming... Try looking at all the thread titles if you doubt what I said. I doubt you'll find much bating posted in my name.

 

[Ardsgaine]

Sorry Ards....I would say throwing a Nazi lable up for me to catch is pretty fucking flaming

You mean tossing it back to you, don't you? Haven't you been insisting that the nazis are right-wing? You're just pissed at having it thrown back to the left where it belongs, and not being able to field it.

Let's get it straight, though. I never once called you a nazi, or tried to pin that label on you. You're just trying to weasel out of the general debate by acting like you've been personally insulted. You can't win the argument, so you've changed the argument.

 

[Jeslek]

Gee I'd hate to argue against you Ards. What did you get your degree in? Philosophy?

 

[Gonz]

Here's an idea, why don't we let the majority run the country?

Becasue the majority are ignorant fools. If we have a democracy, then the first time some drunken iron worker asks for a vote on "sex:when, where & however you want it" it would pass by the majority. And women would be screwed, pun fully intended.


If you think the other party in a debate is wrong, offer proof & an argument convincing enough to change minds. If none of that is applicable call them names until they cry.

 

[outside looking in]

I think that the social and economic categories are inextricably bound together. If fascism and communism differ on exactly how they are going to appropriate private property and violate individual rights, that's just a superficial difference.

Just to clarify, I agree that they are inextricably linked in practice, but not in theory. It is just as possible (in theory) to have a democratic communist nation as it is to have a totalitarian capitalist nation. In theory, the social and economical categories are distinct. In practice however, at least historically, they have always been linked to some degree.

 

[Squiggy]

Sorry Ards....I would say throwing a Nazi label up for me to catch is pretty fucking flaming

You mean tossing it back to you, don't you? Haven't you been insisting that the nazis are right-wing? You're just pissed at having it thrown back to the left where it belongs, and not being able to field it.

Let's get it straight, though. I never once called you a nazi, or tried to pin that label on you. You're just trying to weasel out of the general debate by acting like you've been personally insulted. You can't win the argument, so you've changed the argument.

I can only recall asking why the right was always trying to throw labels at the left. I used the defense that I don't come in here and start calling right wingers fascists or nazis and I didn't appreciate being called a commie etc...You actually felt some kind of need to throw the term nazi at the left. I consider myself closer to center than most right wingers in this forum. Like I said, you won't find me hanging threads for the purpose of argument or to widen the gap. oli seems to think its ok for a right winger to throw flames into a decent conversation but if I laugh at his efforts, I'm wrong? ol'man seems to think the appropriate reply to everything is that Clinton got a blow job. The only reason any of you get away with it is because your collective arrogance has driven all left or moderate views from the forum. So now its your playground. Enjoy it. I'm going back to the forums where people care more about people than $$$ and material possessions....

 

[outside looking in]

oli seems to think its ok for a right winger to throw flames into a decent conversation but if I laugh at his efforts, I'm wrong?

First, I haven't flamed you anywhere in this thread.

Second, I don't see where Ards did, at least until you started with the "rabid right, kill whoever you want, fuck all of you" type of comments.

Third, what you are probably thinking is a flame is his labeling of Hitler and Nazism as left wing. It's all a matter of how you define the spectrum; Ards has made his definition perfectly clear and this and other threads he has used that definition perfectly consistently.

Fourth, you're wrong not because you laugh at his efforts, but simply because you are wrong. Making statements that all dictators are the epitome of capitalism is inflamatory and utterly incorrect. Being wrong is fine, and so is posting inflamatory statements, unless you're going to be a hypocrite and bitch about any labels others might use while making sweeping generalizations all over the place yourself.

 

[Squiggy]

I didn't say YOU flamed me. But you jumped on me for laughing at ol'man's attempts to flame me. And I AM sick and tired of this stupid fucking 'pin the tag on the left' game that permeates in here. And I AM at the point where I start thinking about why I'm putting up with this abuse from war mongers who never served their countries but don't think twice about sending others to die so they feel more comfortable watching the news in their living rooms.
Ards threw that Nazi label in the ring in a left/right political context. Not in a socioeconomic context. We all know that they take on different meanings IRL than they do in 'theory'. Communism would be wonderful if it followed the theoretical. But we also know that it is synonomous with Cuba, Russia, China, N.Korea, etc.....None of which are true or significantly true forms of communism....

 

[Jeslek]

And I AM at the point where I start thinking about why I'm putting up with this abuse from war mongers who never served their countries but don't think twice about sending others to die so they feel more comfortable watching the news in their living rooms

So if you never served you should have no opinion?

 

[AlladinSane]

Oh, yeah... fuck you too.

Ah, Leslie, now I've got what you meant...

 

[Squiggy]

I'm afraid I'm to blame for that one, AS. I expressed that sentiment first so don't hold it against Ards.

 

[Ardsgaine]

Ards threw that Nazi label in the ring in a left/right political context.

You need to find that post and show it to us, because I've searched through my posts of the past couple of weeks and I can't find it.

Communism would be wonderful if it followed the theoretical. But we also know that it is synonomous with Cuba, Russia, China, N.Korea, etc.....None of which are true or significantly true forms of communism....

If you want to make that argument why don't you go to the thread I started on the subject and answer my arguments there?

 

[Squiggy]

Its your 'Name this tune" thread. You paint the theoretical picture then extract the conclusion and paste it into the US left/right political line. Then you fucking bumped the thread and aimed it at me. Now why the fuck would I get pissed about someone painting me with the same brush they just painted Hitler and Bin Laden with....I fucking wonder...

 

[Leslie]

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