Saturdays Vote

[Gonz]

So, AB & chcr, you believe that turning a country around takes, what, 6-8 weeks? Fruitful endings are never preceded by turmoil & hardship?

The war on terror was taken to the terrorists. Iraq had been shooting at coalition aircraft for 12 years. Iraq had violated virtually every single UN mandate simply because the UN members were getting rich & ignoring the violations was more economically advantageous to Koffees kid & several of his office personel. Iraq had at least one government sponsored terrorist training camp. Iraq rewarded individual terrorists to kill Jews. Iraq had not proven to have destroyed WMDs, as per the accord, so was properly assumed to have them. Unlike the left, I never expected a warehouse full of ICBMs. That is not the only way to attack another country. No, Iraq is (and was) not the center of terrorism in the world. Blowing up Afghanistan moved them forward 800 years. Going into places like Yemen or The Sudan would have been moving them ahead 3 eons. They had nothing to blow up & they aren't politically sufficient to make any changes. Had Iraq followed UN mandates, Saddam & friends may still be in charge & wouldn't that make liberals happy.

Nobody said it would be quick. In fact, we were specifically forewarned that the war on terror is a long term dilemma. Too bad we now expect microwave quickness for everything.

They voted. Let's see what happens. The Iraqi people are ready to end terrorism. Are you?

 

[chcr]

1. Find any (any) WMDs?
2. Find Bin Laden?
3. Destroy Al-Qaida?
4. Stamp out world-wide terrorism?
6. Increase stability in the middle east?
7. Free Afghanistan?

NOT working.

8. It's been significantly more than six to eight weeks.

 

[Gonz]

1. Find any (any) WMDs?

They did. It was ignored since it wasn't ICBMs.

2. Find Bin Laden?

I still think he's dead. Who says we haven't found him? Upon acknowledgment of his capture/death, the world will immediately find th ewar on terror victorious & over.

3. Destroy Al-Qaida?

We still haven't destroyed Naziism.

4. Stamp out world-wide terrorism?

Closer today than 4 years ago. It'll never be eliminated. It can be corralled.

6. Increase stability in the middle east?

Happened. Happening. Will continue to happen,

7. Free Afghanistan?

Done.

8. It's been significantly more than six to eight weeks.

Yes it has. It may be 8 more years. The complaints act as though it should be over as quickly & easily as Grenada.

 

[A.B.Normal]

7. Free Afghanistan?

Done.

So the fact that a former Taliban commander is a likely winner in the recent National Assembly voting means they're free.

 

[Gonz]

recent National Assembly voting

Freedom to commit stupidity is stil freedom. They may choose to turn it over, as have most voters in most countries it'll be by free choice.

 

[A.B.Normal]

Freedom to commit stupidity is stil freedom. They may choose to turn it over, as have most voters in most countries it'll be by free choice.

So if they want to reinstate the Taleban/Al Qaeda your all for it,wow things really have improved in Afghanistan

 

[chcr]

Rose colored glasses anyone?

 

[Gonz]

We can't preach freedom if we interfere with their right to be idiots.

 

[chcr]

We can't preach freedom if we interfere with their right to be idiots.

They're only free to set up a gov't we approve (either the Afghans or the Iraqis) of and you know it. Their freedom is a political fiction.

 

[crystal scan]

sounds good to me

 

[flavio]

Seems they are taking a few of Bush's strategies on how to rig an election....

Hamid Hassan Mohammad, a 28-year-old school principal in the village of Jazeera, part of the wider Ishaki area, said there was a conspiracy to prevent Sunnis from casting votes.

Shortly after being told to leave the polling station, he said, "Maybe they did this on purpose. There are a lot of organizations who have spent a lot of money on this referendum, and they want to see they get the right result. ... There are lots of empty ballot papers, and their top officials will be filling them in with 'yes' to make sure the constitution passes. It's the fault of those in high positions and the bosses in Baghdad, and they will fix it."

Coordinators for the Independent Electoral Commission for Iraq in the area, supported by a huge U.S. troop presence and Iraqi security services, insisted it was a genuine mistake and rushed to remedy the situation, removing the voting restriction. But for Sunnis, out in force on Saturday after January's election boycott, the damage had been done.

There was also confusion about what the vote was actually about. Ayub Khuthir, one of the first to show up in Ishaki, said he had not been given any information about the constitution. As the 35-year-old farmer passed through a weapons search, he said, "I've no idea about this. We are simple village people, and have not been told anything. I have not seen a copy of the constitution, and I have not got a television to hear about what's in it."

More here....

 

[Gonz]

Damn flavio, update your playbook.

 

[flavio]

Damn Gonz, say something relevant.

 

[chcr]

There are a lot of organizations who have spent a lot of money on this referendum, and they want to see they get the right result.

Damn, they are learning how to run their country like America, aren't they?

 

[samcurry]

"There was also confusion about what the vote was actually about. Ayub Khuthir, one of the first to show up in Ishaki, said he had not been given any information about the constitution. As the 35-year-old farmer passed through a weapons search, he said, "I've no idea about this. We are simple village people, and have not been told anything. I have not seen a copy of the constitution, and I have not got a television to hear about what's in it." "
So for over a year he has known about the process comming up and he doesnt know what it says? How stupid. I cannot and will not feel sympathy for the ignorant. if he was capable of finding out there was an election coming up then he could have gotten a copy of the constition. He was lazy like most voters....

 

[Bobby Hogg]

How exactly would you know about his ability to get a copy of the constitution?

 

[samcurry]

exactly the same way that you assume he couldnt get a copy of it. How did he find out there was an election? no tv, did a carrier pidgeon deliver the news to him? Im sure he went into town more than just this one time to vote.
And he didnt think to ask for it or some type of information when he showed up to vote? I would think if i really wanted to know what i was voting for and couldnt get the information before hand, he atleast would have thought to ask before he actually voted. but like i said a lazy voter.

 

[Inkara1]

Seems they are taking a few of Bush's strategies on how to rig an election....

/me checks the calendar

Well, what do you know. My sense of time's not off after all! It really is 2005 and not 2000. I wasn't sure for a minute there.

 

[flavio]

/me checks the calendar

Well, what do you know. My sense of time's not off after all! It really is 2005 and not 2000. I wasn't sure for a minute there.

The idea of a strategy from the past used in the present really throws you off that much? That's a shame.

 

[Gato_Solo]

See, you completely misunderstand. It's not that "it's hard so why bother," it's that it's not working, so why keep doing it. When something doesn't work, intelligent people do something else. Of course, we're not supposed to notice that it's not working, right?

You do realize that you said the same thing Gonz said, only in different terms, right? If you really wish to make a change, then you have to start by doing something. If one thing doesn't work, then you must try another. I don't see you coming up with any ideas...only assessing blame. Until you, and yours, can come up with something positive to do then I'd like to make a suggestion...