London shaken by explosions

[chcr]

See---some of us realize that we need to show the terrorists what fear really is.

Congratulations. You are offically no better than they are. I'll bet your mom is so proud...


Oh, and a point of information. We kill more of us every month driving back and forth to work than they ever have. "If we are to survive..." Could you be any more melodramatic?

Further question: I'm the kind of guy who will strap 25 pounds of C4 to my ass and go into a public place and push the fucking button, but I'm really frightened of being shot by a cop?????? Work on your rhetoric for a while, it doesn't make sense.

 

[MrBishop]

with maps of the New York City subway system and video of New York landmarks

Sounds like your average tourists... 'cept that they looked Muslim.

 

[The Other One]

What a way to avoid answering a direct question.

It's in there---I guess I should have lead with it for the people who just see what they want to see.

See---some of us realize that we need to show the terrorists what fear really is. The bigger and louder the better. They have to be afraid of us. To realize that we are one big scary MoFo. If we are to survive they must fear us.

Do you think the police just singled him out because he looked Muslim, walked up to him, and put 8 shots to the back of his head---all because he looked like, acted like, smelled like a terrorist? And it would be a nice little statement to his handlers?

Wasn't the question asking if it was OK to kill innocents in order to get the terrorists to fear us? The answer simplified is that we need to do anything within our military power to get them to crap their pants in fear any time they even think of the word "United States of America."

If innocents get themselves killed by police who are operating on the information they had at the time, that the police thought they would be protecting MORE innocents from a maddog terrorist with bomb--whose fault is it that he is dead?

So here's the story that guesses why he ran:

BBC home affairs correspondent Danny Shaw said the type of visa Mr Menezes had been given would normally be valid for one-and-a-half to two years.

He said Mr Menezes had not renewed the visa, adding: "That wouldn't explain why he was shot, but it might provide an explanation as to why he ran away -if that is indeed what he did do."

Over the past year there have been an increased number of immigration checks at Tube stations - a policy widely reported in Brazilian papers in London.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4713753.stm

Because he was an illegal immigrant. Do you suppose he just forgot that his visa had expired and no one would notice? I wonder why he didn't want to renew it? Doesn't explain leaving the house that was under surveillance though, or what the deal was with the bulky coat.

 

[chcr]

It's in there---I guess I should have lead with it for the people who just see what they want to see.




Do you think the police just singled him out because he looked Muslim, walked up to him, and put 8 shots to the back of his head---all because he looked like, acted like, smelled like a terrorist? And it would be a nice little statement to his handlers?

Wasn't the question asking if it was OK to kill innocents in order to get the terrorists to fear us? The answer simplified is that we need to do anything within our military power to get them to crap their pants in fear any time they even think of the word "United States of America."

If innocents get themselves killed by police who are operating on the information they had at the time, that the police thought they would be protecting MORE innocents from a maddog terrorist with bomb--whose fault is it that he is dead?

So here's the story that guesses why he ran:



Because he was an illegal immigrant. Do you suppose he just forgot that his visa had expired and no one would notice? I wonder why he didn't want to renew it? Doesn't explain leaving the house that was under surveillance though, or what the deal was with the bulky coat.

You should quit while your behind...

 

[The Other One]

Congratulations. You are offically no better than they are. I'll bet your mom is so proud...

Like I said before: You can't teach them by setting the example. By being "better than them." You won't get it into their heads that THIS is how you should act. They KNOW what they are doing. They LIKE what they are doing. They aren't going to STOP what they are doing, unless they become VERY AFRAID of us.

Like I asked before: What is your solution?

Oh, and a point of information. We kill more of us every month driving back and forth to work than they ever have. "If we are to survive..." Could you be any more melodramatic?

Can't you see there is a difference between car accidents and Islamic terrorists bent on our destruction? They aren't going to go away if you ignore them.

Melodramatic---ha! Don't you know that this country's very survival is indeed at stake? You can't click your heels together and say "there's no place like home" anymore---because tho it bears much semblance to the life you know and love---it has changed drastically.

Maybe that's the problem.

I asked what do you think the U.S. will be like in 20 years if we didn't stand up against their attacks. Any opinions on that?

 

[The Other One]

Sounds like your average tourists... 'cept that they looked Muslim.

Sound like enemy combatants to me. They should be sent to GITMO and not back to their homeland. The CIA should ship 'em down to GITMO and terrorize them with female guards and dogs with big fangs, pile them up naked with panties on their heads and turn the A/C on real low and mishandle their kurran 'till they beg for mercy and ask Allah if there really are 72 virgins waiting for them or is that just a line to get them to kill the infidels?

 

[The Other One]

Still waiting for a description of the U.S. if we appease them instead of kicking ass.

Or a solution to Islamic terrorism if it is NOT kicking ass.

 

[Winky]

a solution to Islamic terrorism if it is NOT kicking ass.

Why take the PC route of course!
Elect Hillary in 08 and let em' hit as often as they choose.
Withdraw from Iraq and let the bad guys overrun the place.
Lament how Bush brought all this on U.S.
All the hand wringing will result in carpal tunnel!

 

[Winky]

hand-wringing

 

[chcr]

Still waiting for a description of the U.S. if we appease them instead of kicking ass.

Or a solution to Islamic terrorism if it is NOT kicking ass.

As before, I have never advocated appeasing the terrorists. You see what you want to see, regardless of what I actually post. This leaves us not having the same discussion. I fully understand what happened in London, I fully expect it to happen again, there or somewhere else. The only way, however that it can be "justified" is as you say, as a warning to the terrorists. Okay, now you have killed an innocent person to attempt to frighten your enemy (a tactic that clearly does not work most of the time, regardless of what the fanatics think). This is the very definition of terrorism. If you can't address the actual debate, stay out of it.

Fuck it, I say kill everyone involved with any religion and let god sort 'em out.

 

[MrBishop]

Sound like enemy combatants to me. They should be sent to GITMO and not back to their homeland. The CIA should ship 'em down to GITMO and terrorize them with female guards and dogs with big fangs, pile them up naked with panties on their heads and turn the A/C on real low and mishandle their kurran 'till they beg for mercy and ask Allah if there really are 72 virgins waiting for them or is that just a line to get them to kill the infidels?

That is exactly the kind of mindset that the terrorists are trying to encourage. Looking around scared for anyone that looks suspect, civilians jumping at shadows, lost bags clearing subways, killing innocent people, hasseling innocent Muslims to the point where the mulsims that are on our side start rethinking their choice...panic and...terror. If you send those 4 Egyptians to Gitmo and all they were were tourists...how do you think the rest of the Egyptians will feel about it? Other Muslims? Other countries... it's bad enough that the world already thinks that the USA is going overboard in Iraq, do you really want to give them more ammo?

The thing about fear...the kind of fear that you want to instill in the terrorists, is that it's not a precise instrument. You end up causing fear in everyone who is even remotely associated with those you call terrorists, even if the only link is religion. You can't declare war on a whole religion...it's been attempted before and we lost...twice.

 

[The Other One]

As before, I have never advocated appeasing the terrorists. If you can't address the actual debate, stay out of it.

So do you get to give the orders around here? I guess I missed

that sticky.



Since you don't seem to like the idea of scaring the terrorists into

submission

I was just asking you what the answer would be

if it isn't to make the terrorists afraid of us so they wouldn't attack us?

I am curious: What does the Liberal mind think are the other REAL

options that would actually WORK

to END Islmaic terrorism?? Do you really think there are any??

 

[Winky]

As before, I have never advocated appeasing the terrorists.

Yes, what with you being a Liberal and all
you don't advocate any solutions, merely sit on the sidelines
and decry the actions of those who are
handling your fate.

Typical, standard operating procedure.

Now this is the part where you get to state your solution to the issue.

Or as the common cliché goes:
Lead, follow or get the hell outta the way!

Oh and don’t worry, Billary is going to run and lose
thereby guarantying 12 great years of Republicans
@ 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue.

 

[The Other One]

That is exactly the kind of mindset that the terrorists are trying to encourage.

Actually, I think they are trying to encourage the profiling of Middle Eastern men between the ages of 18 and 45.

If you send those 4 Egyptians to Gitmo and all they were were tourists...how do you think the rest of the Egyptians will feel about it? Other Muslims? Other countries... it's bad enough that the world already thinks that the USA is going overboard in Iraq, do you really want to give them more ammo?

After hearing of the luxury they are afforded at this fine tropical paradise I'm sure they can't wait.

Oh, the whole wide world doesn't like the USA! Whatever will we do??

...it's been attempted before and we lost...twice.

WE? Canada and ? You must mean "we" as in "we are the world"?

 

[chcr]

Or as the common cliché goes:
Lead, follow or get the hell outta the way!

Just as you do, Wink, just as you do...

 

[MrBishop]

WE? Canada and ? You must mean "we" as in "we are the world"?

We as in Christians, sunshine. I was talking about religious wars, which is effectivly, what you're advocating.

 

[chcr]

So do you get to give the orders around here? I guess I missed

that sticky.



Since you don't seem to like the idea of scaring the terrorists into

submission

I was just asking you what the answer would be

if it isn't to make the terrorists afraid of us so they wouldn't attack us?

I am curious: What does the Liberal mind think are the other REAL

options that would actually WORK

to END Islmaic terrorism?? Do you really think there are any??

1. Not a liberal (I simply refuse to believe that that many of you are that dense, despite all evidence to the contrary).
2. Scaring the terrorists into submission is fine, what are they scared of?
3. By all means, attack the terrorists where they are. We haven't yet, let's try it and see if it works. Except of course that we never will, will we?
4. Again, none of this addresses the point. The point was that if you advocate the killing of innocent people to make a political point against your enemies, then you are a terrorist. Yes, I do think that's wrong, I don't like terrorism. I'm against it in principle and in practice. You, OTOH seem to advocate it (unless someone is Muslim anyway).


Another point of information while you're parroting the rhetoric of the radical right. The second most deadly terrorist act on American soil was perpetrated not my Muslims but by your fellows. Perhaps this is why you find it so easy to adopt their tactics.

So do you get to give the orders around here? I guess I missed

that sticky.

P.S. Hardly an order, just a suggestion.

Oh, and for Bish: If you're a middle-eastern immigrant between the ages of 18 and 45, you should expect to be profiled, investigated and deported if a single t is not crossed, i is not dotted. You'd be a fool to expect otherwise given the political climate and we'd be foolish to do otherwise given the same. It's not pretty but it is necessary.

 

[MrBishop]

Oh, and for Bish: If you're a middle-eastern immigrant between the ages of 18 and 45, you should expect to be profiled, investigated and deported if a single t is not crossed, i is not dotted. You'd be a fool to expect otherwise given the political climate and we'd be foolish to do otherwise given the same. It's not pretty but it is necessary.

Granted...but sending them all to Gitmo, like TOO is suggesting is not the way to go. I'm very big on the idea of exporting people who commit crimes back to their hometown...but not on suspition alone.

t's still 'innocent until proven guilty'

 

[freako104]

t's still 'innocent until proven guilty'

In theory yes. In practice not so much

 

[Winky]

Huh? Oh nevah mind.